State of the Game - The Truth (In the OP's eyes)

  • Cathedral_Rock
    Cathedral_Rock
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Feb 2013 Posts: 8,604
    bort said:
    Build Times: Longer than ever for everything
    Less Chores: More chores than ever
    Raid Specific Hulls: Raid comes out before you can build even 1/2 fleet
    Bounty Hunt: Give stronger tech to players who are already unstoppable


    Changed the title to reflect the topic. Laredo


    The catch with buildtimes is eventhough some ships maybe slightly quicker to build than their previous counterparts, due to needing more fleets for all the different parts in the game now; it certainly seems like buildtimes have gone up. Also if you can't get the tokens from T5 of the FM yet; that makes the buildtimes even worse. 
    my siege cannon strike cruisers were around 25 days a piece. the fleet took over 3 months to build.

    it does not seem like build times have gone up. Unless your memory is real short.
    What you so conveniently FORGET ( as usual) is your 25 day Strike cruiser could do EVERYTHING. Baseguard, basehit, Drac bases, FM, raids. NOW with the ship required for every task at 15 days per ship PER TASK thats 75 DAYS for ONE ship for each task. So YES overall build times have skyrocketed.
    ...which brings us back to where we started itt, with the tokens raining from the heavens like so much champagne
    Those Tokens require fleets to be built, ranked and ready.

    You seem to forget that most players struggle to actually get any tokens.
    tokens build ships faster. Funny statement considering by this time I know one or two people and nobody is having a hard time playing the most basic part of the game.I do not know it could be translated to most people.   I have noticed that the focus seems that the complainers want the game changed to make it easier for them and give bonuses  that most players have enjoyed the game without, but do not consider that maybe the  problem is not the game but something that they are doing wrong or expect..
    My point is this.

    This game has lost many many players over the last two years.
    New players are very much needed.

    But new players won't stick around in a game that penalises them for being new.
    Once they are level 50 they will be getting smashed by players that get tokens every week from FM (something they themselves will not be able to achieve for months and months).
    Without these tokens, they are on the (very) slow road to progression.

    In the time it takes a lvl 50 to build 1 fleet of Citadels, the lvl 100 could have built 4 fleets of [insert latest top prizes].
    Each week/month, they lvl 50 slips further and further behind.

    Now, this isn't a whine, it is simply stating the facts, people don't tend to stick around in these situations.
    that base hitting issue has been around since day 1.  Every single person over level 50 reading this has had to make it through that.  Do you understand that?  Players that can't learn from that experience are probably not going to make good overall players in the end.

    tokens, by their nature, are a perk.  they need to be earned.  players should have a full collection of tech to put on their hulls before reaching the point where they are routinely winning tokens.  otherwise, those free hulls aren't worth a spit.

    maybe you're using the wrong ship as an example.  A citadel is a 3-day base build.  For the purpose of the FM, it doesn't  even need armor.

    I dispute your facts.
  • Makarovnik
    Makarovnik
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Aug 2017 Posts: 244
    edited 12 Oct 2017, 11:20AM
    Although there may be evidence to the contrary in my personal experience, vs the original OP's statements, the number of likes vs the number of dislikes in the OP speaks VOLUMES. Feel free to ignore populist paradigm and the community at large (right or wrong) after all they're only a small part of this game and NOT its "raison d'etre", right? I wonder which one of you emporers in skivvies will mutter "let them eat cake" first. Because logic and legality will be with you, of course. After all, Rome didn't burn down in a day. Go ahead shoot down my logic, I hope it makes y'all feel better, in the end. Despise me for pointing all this out, if it helps, I triple dirty dog dare ya, neener neener boo boo. So what if its painfully simplistic a solution. It is just a game after all and right or wrong the common folk just want to have fun. Should we take so much so seriously here? As the insectors are so fond of pointing out, "I'll play the game MY way, thank you."
  • daniel.larubbio83
    daniel.larubbio83
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Jun 2013 Posts: 176

    As a level 112 I’m sorry a level 60 shouldn’t be able to get same prizes as me. The game is of patience. I remember grinding 7 million points to get a Dnx that took me 3 months to build. So in this raid coming up 10-20 million is reasonable with right amount of chair time. Tideseaker if built right can do something

  • WINTER25
    WINTER25
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Dec 2013 Posts: 292
    bort said:
    Build Times: Longer than ever for everything
    Less Chores: More chores than ever
    Raid Specific Hulls: Raid comes out before you can build even 1/2 fleet
    Bounty Hunt: Give stronger tech to players who are already unstoppable


    Changed the title to reflect the topic. Laredo


    The catch with buildtimes is eventhough some ships maybe slightly quicker to build than their previous counterparts, due to needing more fleets for all the different parts in the game now; it certainly seems like buildtimes have gone up. Also if you can't get the tokens from T5 of the FM yet; that makes the buildtimes even worse. 
    my siege cannon strike cruisers were around 25 days a piece. the fleet took over 3 months to build.

    it does not seem like build times have gone up. Unless your memory is real short.
    What you so conveniently FORGET ( as usual) is your 25 day Strike cruiser could do EVERYTHING. Baseguard, basehit, Drac bases, FM, raids. NOW with the ship required for every task at 15 days per ship PER TASK thats 75 DAYS for ONE ship for each task. So YES overall build times have skyrocketed.
    ...which brings us back to where we started itt, with the tokens raining from the heavens like so much champagne
    Those Tokens require fleets to be built, ranked and ready.

    You seem to forget that most players struggle to actually get any tokens.
    tokens build ships faster. Funny statement considering by this time I know one or two people and nobody is having a hard time playing the most basic part of the game.I do not know it could be translated to most people.   I have noticed that the focus seems that the complainers want the game changed to make it easier for them and give bonuses  that most players have enjoyed the game without, but do not consider that maybe the  problem is not the game but something that they are doing wrong or expect..
    My point is this.

    This game has lost many many players over the last two years.
    New players are very much needed.

    But new players won't stick around in a game that penalises them for being new.
    Once they are level 50 they will be getting smashed by players that get tokens every week from FM (something they themselves will not be able to achieve for months and months).
    Without these tokens, they are on the (very) slow road to progression.

    In the time it takes a lvl 50 to build 1 fleet of Citadels, the lvl 100 could have built 4 fleets of [insert latest top prizes].
    Each week/month, they lvl 50 slips further and further behind.

    Now, this isn't a whine, it is simply stating the facts, people don't tend to stick around in these situations.
    that base hitting issue has been around since day 1.  Every single person over level 50 reading this has had to make it through that.  Do you understand that?  Players that can't learn from that experience are probably not going to make good overall players in the end.

    tokens, by their nature, are a perk.  they need to be earned.  players should have a full collection of tech to put on their hulls before reaching the point where they are routinely winning tokens.  otherwise, those free hulls aren't worth a spit.

    maybe you're using the wrong ship as an example.  A citadel is a 3-day base build.  For the purpose of the FM, it doesn't  even need armor.

    I dispute your facts.

    we have shown folks in our alliance how to clear a 113 with 1 zelos tank and 1 unarmored citadel.. so it is possible.. does it take time??oh hell yeah.. are they going to take damage??oh yes.. but that's teir 4 at least... in 3 days they can easily get to teir 5 if they push a bit..most don't want to.. that's their call.. but we've showed that it is possible.. 
  • GrumpyReign
    GrumpyReign
    Master Tactician
    Joined Dec 2012 Posts: 2,360

    As a level 112 I’m sorry a level 60 shouldn’t be able to get same prizes as me.

    why?
    I can feel you judging me. That's palpable. But, hey, I never said I was the hero of this story.
  • Dazandren
    Dazandren
    Incursion Leader
    Joined Mar 2013 Posts: 1,455
    ***Y_A_W_N***      i'm gonna take a nap.    :s
    image
  • daniel.larubbio83
    daniel.larubbio83
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Jun 2013 Posts: 176

    @GrumpyReign said:
    daniel.larubbio83 said:

    As a level 112 I’m sorry a level 60 shouldn’t be able to get same prizes as me.

    why?

    Because I’m 50 Levels ahead

  • GrumpyReign
    GrumpyReign
    Master Tactician
    Joined Dec 2012 Posts: 2,360

    @GrumpyReign said:
    daniel.larubbio83 said:

    As a level 112 I’m sorry a level 60 shouldn’t be able to get same prizes as me.

    why?

    Because I’m 50 Levels ahead

    not gonna lie. that's not particularly compelling.
    I can feel you judging me. That's palpable. But, hey, I never said I was the hero of this story.
  • The Jury
    The Jury
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Jan 2012 Posts: 150
    bort said:
    The Jury said:
    Build Times: Longer than ever for everything
    Less Chores: More chores than ever
    Raid Specific Hulls: Raid comes out before you can build even 1/2 fleet
    Bounty Hunt: Give stronger tech to players who are already unstoppable


    Changed the title to reflect the topic. Laredo


    The way I see it, (and I've seen alot since 2011 playing this game) is WHO CARES about the "back in my day brigade". The problem as I see it is the game is not evolving quick enough in reductions to entice the next generation of coining gamers to actually come in and play for any lengthy period. 
    Theres a whole new market segment out there that kix may not be able to entice in because of the issues the OP has specified. So while us players that think "yeah great, build times are coming down; chores are a choice and you need to strategize your builds accordingly in order to progress further", there is an element that will continue to grow (due to market evolution) that thinks these issues are REAL relevant and spoiling their opportunity to participate in what is actually a great concept game.They simply walk away and find something more "instantaneous gratification". And trust me, this segement market is going to get bigger over time, will kixeye be there relying on non-coining straterrgisers? 

    The OP has a point, those of us players that have seen times drop, tokens appear, coining specials available etc  also have a point. I think the real statement is weather kixeye can continue to attract a new market target audience of gamers to participate with the issues the OP has rightly pointed out in his eyes, and likely the new generation(s) of target market amoungst growing competition.

    The 4 items the OP has posted are surely something us "old players"(or longtime players) are happy to offer facts compared to when we started and its TRUE, but as I said, no new gamer actually cares what happended in revenge raid 1, or the first reaver raid or how long it took to build the first flag hull. As the new market expectations are realised, we (some) also change our views accordingly (evolution) and join the flow.

    Kix is certainly changing to keep coining players of old, but are they really reducing things enough for the next generation in market? 
    For the record, im in favour of anything to reduce times. Why the heck wouldn't anyone playing this game like to have reduced times, seems an odd argument to say otherwise me thinks.

    Good thread BTW, refreshing....
    its a strategy game. not a shootemup.
    you deserve a medal for pointing out the obvious bort. Every gaming platform needs to attract new blood/coin and if there are barriers to customers having a memorable experience and returning then companies don't meet their financial targets, regardless of their niche. Hence the proven market thats out there and growing,  is looking for that gratification not dissimlar to your "shootemups". 
    And yet, across the gulf of oceans, minds presumably superior to ours regarded this game with envious eyes; and slowly, and surely, they drew their plans against us.
  • GrumpyReign
    GrumpyReign
    Master Tactician
    Joined Dec 2012 Posts: 2,360
    The Jury said:
    Build Times: Longer than ever for everything
    Less Chores: More chores than ever
    Raid Specific Hulls: Raid comes out before you can build even 1/2 fleet
    Bounty Hunt: Give stronger tech to players who are already unstoppable


    Changed the title to reflect the topic. Laredo


    The way I see it, (and I've seen alot since 2011 playing this game) is WHO CARES about the "back in my day brigade". The problem as I see it is the game is not evolving quick enough in reductions to entice the next generation of coining gamers to actually come in and play for any lengthy period. 
    Theres a whole new market segment out there that kix may not be able to entice in because of the issues the OP has specified. So while us players that think "yeah great, build times are coming down; chores are a choice and you need to strategize your builds accordingly in order to progress further", there is an element that will continue to grow (due to market evolution) that thinks these issues are REAL relevant and spoiling their opportunity to participate in what is actually a great concept game.They simply walk away and find something more "instantaneous gratification". And trust me, this segement market is going to get bigger over time, will kixeye be there relying on non-coining straterrgisers? 

    The OP has a point, those of us players that have seen times drop, tokens appear, coining specials available etc  also have a point. I think the real statement is weather kixeye can continue to attract a new market target audience of gamers to participate with the issues the OP has rightly pointed out in his eyes, and likely the new generation(s) of target market amoungst growing competition.

    The 4 items the OP has posted are surely something us "old players"(or longtime players) are happy to offer facts compared to when we started and its TRUE, but as I said, no new gamer actually cares what happended in revenge raid 1, or the first reaver raid or how long it took to build the first flag hull. As the new market expectations are realised, we (some) also change our views accordingly (evolution) and join the flow.

    Kix is certainly changing to keep coining players of old, but are they really reducing things enough for the next generation in market? 
    For the record, im in favour of anything to reduce times. Why the heck wouldn't anyone playing this game like to have reduced times, seems an odd argument to say otherwise me thinks.

    Good thread BTW, refreshing....
    well, aren't you just the motivatedest li'l engine that could, mansplainin' how to sell T8 retrofits in this podunk LED world..
    I can feel you judging me. That's palpable. But, hey, I never said I was the hero of this story.
  • p_b82
    p_b82
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Sep 2011 Posts: 566
    I think that if you take the posters points at face value of what they are as written they are mostly all false.

    But I do get where the mindset is that one can feel it to be otherwise..... compared to the days of SW builds and insta repairs yes everything takes longer..... but that was so long ago we can't use it as a reference point. so to go back 12-24 months, the introduction of tokens and the reduction of build time of components + hulls has massively dropped.

    the hull build/refit lottery of raids no longer exists - you get given at least one if not 2 chances for the null needed for the next series 1 month in advance, we now know the damage types, and can attempt to prepare alternatives. All of these things are improvements and give the playerbase a higher % chance of being able to do raid1, and if not, then def raids 2 &3 + later TLCs.

    I think one of the other posters has made the point - many people that start this game want instant gratification. they see it it as something they can jump in quickly and suddenly beat up players (or environment targets) that players who've been playing years may struggle to hit unless they are right on the top of their game.... it is a totally unrealistic expectation.

    I'll be honest I got hooked on the fast paced nature of the game in the black water days - the 20min downtime then back out with your fleet to go chase the raiders off..... but that game doesn't exist anymore and maybe the game description needs to be one that makes it clearer this is more longer term strategic planning with a instant battle aspect rather than the other way round due to the way the game has evolved and matured over time.


  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 8,257
    The Jury said:
    bort said:
    The Jury said:
    Build Times: Longer than ever for everything
    Less Chores: More chores than ever
    Raid Specific Hulls: Raid comes out before you can build even 1/2 fleet
    Bounty Hunt: Give stronger tech to players who are already unstoppable


    Changed the title to reflect the topic. Laredo


    The way I see it, (and I've seen alot since 2011 playing this game) is WHO CARES about the "back in my day brigade". The problem as I see it is the game is not evolving quick enough in reductions to entice the next generation of coining gamers to actually come in and play for any lengthy period. 
    Theres a whole new market segment out there that kix may not be able to entice in because of the issues the OP has specified. So while us players that think "yeah great, build times are coming down; chores are a choice and you need to strategize your builds accordingly in order to progress further", there is an element that will continue to grow (due to market evolution) that thinks these issues are REAL relevant and spoiling their opportunity to participate in what is actually a great concept game.They simply walk away and find something more "instantaneous gratification". And trust me, this segement market is going to get bigger over time, will kixeye be there relying on non-coining straterrgisers? 

    The OP has a point, those of us players that have seen times drop, tokens appear, coining specials available etc  also have a point. I think the real statement is weather kixeye can continue to attract a new market target audience of gamers to participate with the issues the OP has rightly pointed out in his eyes, and likely the new generation(s) of target market amoungst growing competition.

    The 4 items the OP has posted are surely something us "old players"(or longtime players) are happy to offer facts compared to when we started and its TRUE, but as I said, no new gamer actually cares what happended in revenge raid 1, or the first reaver raid or how long it took to build the first flag hull. As the new market expectations are realised, we (some) also change our views accordingly (evolution) and join the flow.

    Kix is certainly changing to keep coining players of old, but are they really reducing things enough for the next generation in market? 
    For the record, im in favour of anything to reduce times. Why the heck wouldn't anyone playing this game like to have reduced times, seems an odd argument to say otherwise me thinks.

    Good thread BTW, refreshing....
    its a strategy game. not a shootemup.
    you deserve a medal for pointing out the obvious bort. Every gaming platform needs to attract new blood/coin and if there are barriers to customers having a memorable experience and returning then companies don't meet their financial targets, regardless of their niche. Hence the proven market thats out there and growing,  is looking for that gratification not dissimlar to your "shootemups". 
    yes, and there is a ton of content for a new player.

    turning the game into a shootemup would be a bad idea.

    giving opportunities to work their way up is what is needed. and generally already exists. and can be done for free even.
  • john joseph svelnys
    john joseph svelnys
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Nov 2015 Posts: 505
    edited 13 Oct 2017, 12:49PM
    After every raid cycle there are 4 new generalist specific items added too tier 5 of FM. WHICH takes away 2 weeks of tokens from tier 5. THIS is the start of building ships for the next raid cycle, so I say building fleet for 1st raid of a cycle has become more difficult
  • Specialist aka Specs
    Specialist aka Specs
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Nov 2012 Posts: 9,395
    Thread has ran course and trolling is taking over.

    Thread is now closed
  • michaelg21
    michaelg21
    Force to be Reckoned With
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 1,723
    Build times are shorter for Conqueror hulls-YES. Everything else-sort of. Lots more chores-YES. The other things doesn't really matter. What has been creeping up that wasn't mentioned is REPAIR times!!! Conqueror hulls aside, Tideseekers are a prime example of what is STILL wrong. Harlocks is 7-9 HOURS repair for ONE SHIP. Most chore fleets are 2-4 hrs PER SHIP to repair. And Kix STILL doesn't really offer any repair tokens for this. Many times new ships are released that aren't of much use. The Twinblade comes to mind.
This discussion has been closed.