Actually the simplest fix for subs would be just to make it to where they HAVE to be built with some level of armor, just like a ship has to be built with at least one weapon. That would solve it right there and really not need to add time to a repair.
I can sympathize with the lower level players who use subs as a cost deterrent but those players are having to suffer because you do have some higher level players that either use it as a crutch in place of skill or are just plain ignorant and abuse them. Not all mind you but some.
Rumseeker
Lvl 34
Sector 361
ID 1122925
Browser: Firefox
OS: WIndows 7
"Kicking the crap out of RRs wherever they Frubble"
I think that if they are going to take longer to repair, then it should be because they have MORE ARMOR. Another way of saying that is "don't increase repair time without balancing it with an increase in the base armor value." Which is what Kixeye is talking about doing. I think it's a pretty good idea.
I have a few "battle subs" that I use and they have DU1. I can take a couple hits from enemy ships and still have a sub firing torpedoes. It takes 16 minutes to repair one of those subs, but it's more useful in battle. If base armor were increased, then it would be even stronger. Might take 20 minutes to repair, but it would be a stronger sub, and I'm cool with that.
Battle Pirates 947189
Windows XP SP3
Flash 10.3
Mozilla 7.0.1
Thanks for all the feedback you gave on the subject. We took it all into consideration and decided to move forward with making this go live in the game.
Trying out your new sub adjustment.
On reloading game all subs were damaged, not cool to find in your dock.
Using subs now get damage every time they are used in battle yet they are not hit, some in our sector reporting 50% damage, I have found my fleets a little less than that.
I am hoping the upgrade on subs is bugged as this is happening.
Quick question, why didn't you just take away the instant >5 mins repair option on all fleets? Seems it would have been all round more fair.
I recently got my sfb3 and HB3 so for me all i use is my sw but as someone that used to have subs in the time where sfb3 didnt exist this is yet another kixeye update aimed at higher levels and coiners not everyone is level 30 and up when is there going to be at least some form of balance to the game for those trying to get op5. As a level 30 im secure for the moment butwhat about those who have yet obtain the larger island
Well, evidently the new update added a new glitch. I just hit a salvage, took NO damage on my subs. However, when I came out of the battle, it shows that all of my subs are damaged. Can you please fix that one quickly?
This feature can not come quick enough!!! So tired of people who just spawn subs over and over....etc. Too many people just spawn subs - create a fleet of "no armor" subs with torp4's and then ram them down a players fleet...just to go back to base...instant repair and use that same fleet again on the same sw/bb/levi/ff/hh fleet. And around and around they go until the other players fleet is sunk. ** and for that whine and moan about lower level players needing a "edge" the above tactic is/can be used by any level...33's are using it. So big fail!!!
This feature can not come quick enough!!! So tired of people who just spawn subs over and over....etc. Too many people just spawn subs - create a fleet of "no armor" subs with torp4's and then ram them down a players fleet...just to go back to base...instant repair and use that same fleet again on the same sw/bb/levi/ff/hh fleet. And around and around they go until the other players fleet is sunk. ** and for that whine and moan about lower level players needing a "edge" the above tactic is/can be used by any level...33's are using it. So big fail!!!
If you dont like being attacked FvF, keep your precious ships on the inside where you wont get a repair bill
What kind of testing? Honestly I think only 20 more armor would be good. Not the 40 that was added. Adding just one minute to the repair time will drastically reduce sub spammers.
I say let em keep instant repair and remove the +5 -5 base attack rule, makes em stand to lose something then once they decide to annoy a higher level with em.
They avoid the stalker because it turns slowly and moves slowly. Predators move quickly and turn quickly enough to move out of the way in the hands of a skilled sub driver. They will be used just as much as before, just not by the folks who used them for quick salvaging and competitions.
Will anyone still use predator subs after this, or will people avoid them like they seem to do for the stalker subs, because the repair times seem like they would always be too long relative to the damage capabilities?
Actually, if you read the OP, it says that fleets of a small flagship and 4 predator subs will not be instantly repairable. So, you take an extra minute and break the fleet apart still instant repair.
This buff needs to be so NO predator sub can be instant repaired PERIOD.
And when you have a fleet that takes 14 hours to repair, getting hit by predators, sinking them and your stuck with a 2 hour repair bill for it, then yes, preds should come with a higher repair bill too.
As Paul Preece put it: Pain should equal cost. You wanna inflict that kind of pain and lose? Then I should get to inflict that kind of Pain back on you and Win.
While you increase the repair time, also increase the resource cost of the repair. Let them feel true pain for their actions. Lower Levels should NOT be hitting the higher levels without consequences. And by this I mean a level 23 hitting a level 32 player.
I m level 31 so....My argument is valid... but You think you should be allowed to bully the lil guy with no cost to you right? IN THE INTEREST OF SAVING TIME , I M SURE YOU SAID NO.... SO ILL OUTRIGHT CALL YOU A **** LIAR NOW!
A. The reason we all chose not to put armor on subs is because their was no advantage to doing so.
There was no practical amount of armor to add that would save a sub that surfaced in the wrong place.
Thus, we fought naked, and still you fear us.
B. The game was already balanced, or overbalanced in the favor of higher level players/coiners/hackers/Moderators: Instead of calling them 'Instant Repair Fleets', you could have called them 'Instant Kill Fleets', since every high level player has a Sea Wolf fleet with Engine and Booster mods to kill them with.
C. Now that higher level players are all crazed Blueprint hunters, there are no lower level salvages for lower level players to take. We need subs to take salvage that they won't touch. -which is usually the 6's where subs are evenly matched, since they have to dodge longer range missiles again.
Battle Pirates, sector 467 (currently on tour) ZapruderBuccaneer ('Zap') ID 2418983 NOW Level 55 "It's more fun to be a pirate than to join the navy." - Steven Jobs
Actually, if you read the OP, it says that fleets of a small flagship and 4 predator subs will not be instantly repairable. So, you take an extra minute and break the fleet apart still instant repair.
Currently (before the proposed change) you still have to "break down the fleet" to be able to repair them instantly. It takes 4 minutes to repair a single Predator Sub with no armor. That's a single sub. Assuming you have the Officer and your normal weapons and specials. There has never been an instant repair fleet of subs. You have always had to break them down to single units if they were 100% damaged.
Battle Pirates 947189
Windows XP SP3
Flash 10.3
Mozilla 7.0.1
How can PEACEMAKER make peace?
I can sympathize with the lower level players who use subs as a cost deterrent but those players are having to suffer because you do have some higher level players that either use it as a crutch in place of skill or are just plain ignorant and abuse them. Not all mind you but some.
Lvl 34
Sector 361
ID 1122925
Browser: Firefox
OS: WIndows 7
"Kicking the crap out of RRs wherever they Frubble"
I have a few "battle subs" that I use and they have DU1. I can take a couple hits from enemy ships and still have a sub firing torpedoes. It takes 16 minutes to repair one of those subs, but it's more useful in battle. If base armor were increased, then it would be even stronger. Might take 20 minutes to repair, but it would be a stronger sub, and I'm cool with that.
Windows XP SP3
Flash 10.3
Mozilla 7.0.1
in order to make subs fair, they must also not be capable of being released with minimal hp.
Lvl 34
Sector 361
ID 1122925
Browser: Firefox
OS: WIndows 7
"Kicking the crap out of RRs wherever they Frubble"
7mins repair for no armour Eng3 Hav3.
Oh and you have to repair the added Hit points on yourself lol.
Time to start building those 5 min Wolf builds methinks.
Alliance: DOA
Level: 66
On reloading game all subs were damaged, not cool to find in your dock.
Using subs now get damage every time they are used in battle yet they are not hit, some in our sector reporting 50% damage, I have found my fleets a little less than that.
I am hoping the upgrade on subs is bugged as this is happening.
Quick question, why didn't you just take away the instant >5 mins repair option on all fleets? Seems it would have been all round more fair.
James-GWS
Home: Sector 89
Visted: 470, 244, 132, 90, 425, 296, 383, 47, 57
Guardian Wolves of the Sea
Hulls: Goliath, Strike Cruiser, HHb, Light cruiser, Destroyer, Super Fortress, Interdictor, Dread x, Barracuda, Battlecruiser, Spectre, SSA
Thank you for taking care of this so quickly.
I can see if you are damaged you should not have instant repair but if not damaged you should not have to repair.
If you dont like being attacked FvF, keep your precious ships on the inside where you wont get a repair bill
What kind of testing? Honestly I think only 20 more armor would be good. Not the 40 that was added. Adding just one minute to the repair time will drastically reduce sub spammers.
WTH Swag? I was just bragging Kixeye finally listened and did right by it's players on a feature and you recalled it?
itll be back. there was just a glitch where subs took damage regardless of being hit or not.
My Base Doesn't have to be the Best. It just has to be a harder target than yours.
Putting a Memorial in an enemy sector is like putting a big red shiny button in my face saying "DON'T PUSH"
A. The reason we all chose not to put armor on subs is because their was no advantage to doing so.
There was no practical amount of armor to add that would save a sub that surfaced in the wrong place.
Thus, we fought naked, and still you fear us.
B. The game was already balanced, or overbalanced in the favor of higher level players/coiners/hackers/Moderators: Instead of calling them 'Instant Repair Fleets', you could have called them 'Instant Kill Fleets', since every high level player has a Sea Wolf fleet with Engine and Booster mods to kill them with.
C. Now that higher level players are all crazed Blueprint hunters, there are no lower level salvages for lower level players to take. We need subs to take salvage that they won't touch. -which is usually the 6's where subs are evenly matched, since they have to dodge longer range missiles again.
ZapruderBuccaneer ('Zap')
ID 2418983
NOW Level 55 "It's more fun to be a pirate than to join the navy."
- Steven Jobs
Currently (before the proposed change) you still have to "break down the fleet" to be able to repair them instantly. It takes 4 minutes to repair a single Predator Sub with no armor. That's a single sub. Assuming you have the Officer and your normal weapons and specials. There has never been an instant repair fleet of subs. You have always had to break them down to single units if they were 100% damaged.
Windows XP SP3
Flash 10.3
Mozilla 7.0.1
The change had some unintended side-effects. It will still most likely go live again but it needs tweaking.