Explanation of the great grand rebalance from Paul Preece, founder of KIXEYE

  • John Jones22
    John Jones22
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Feb 2015 Posts: 3,291

    @Dudeabides said:
    CM LXC said:

    How can I feel safe investing time/money into the game when you can just change everything in a heartbeat?

    We decided the best approach was to get all the disruptive changes out in one go. To just rip the band-aid off. More disruptive in the short term but it sets us up to be more consistent in the longer term. One of our key goals for the future is to increase the longevity of ship builds across all classes. It is vital to the health of the game that ships have long useful lives.

    U notice he never said they wouldnt nerf stuff in the future. What a liar. How can any of our ships have long lives when you keep nerfing stuff.

  • Kitson heart
    Kitson heart
    Potential Threat
    Joined Dec 2015 Posts: 64

    Before i starg, any examples i use from in game are purely from me being able to have a good laugh, even if i play in character and act all mad when it happens to me lol. Truly no hard feelings to anyone xD also i swear a lot. Forgive me v.v

    I would like to start that i appreciate thate people from the head of Vega are trying to lear things up. But really, the problem is that a lot of us are happy being at the top and being badass so that nobody can touch us. And i will admit i truly get pissed off when a level 51 fleet repeatedly one to 2 stars my base every single day taking a medal to three every single time (I'm looking at you Bris >u> you're mine as soon as i get to you lol xD ) but again, that's why so many of us are pissed off. We don't want to have to accept the fact that by tomorrow, many of us are going to have been dethroned because we suddenly lost our massive fleets that allowed us to play halo's domination over other people and even entire alliances. Some famed, or infamous depending on your outlook on them, alliances such as ICU might not have much of a problem because they're supposedly used to continuously buying coins so they can keep on laying the heat. Others, such as mine, have the tenacity to wait for a really long time before actually getting up and doing something to see if any attackers get bored or if we have to fight back or flee sector. We usually flee except in a more recent case, but that's besides the point. For everyone whox according to the more vulgar people are "**** and complaining," that's really just it. No matter how hard you look at it, no matter how y9u try to digest it, that's the basis of all this hatred. That people have or haven't spent money, and that they have worked hard to get where they are. Now that they're there, they don't want others to be able to compete with tu em, or flat out just don't want their progress to feel as if they've been wasting their time. Which really, is all video games depending on whether you love em or hate them. That's all there is to it. People just don't want to wake up to see the dreaded day, that they have to learn to play all over again cause the developers "**** them over" with an update. Look at GTA5 when their developers patched a bug that allowed players to hack their specialty cars, only available in the campaign, into the multiplayer. Not only did they stop that, but made it so that if you or anyone got into said cars, to instantly blow up, and be impossible to get back. Now THAT is a big "**** you!" From the developers. And look at kix. They're offering free refits for the ships that may be to heavy now, and even a better fleet bay. Hell, I'd be happier if EVERY ship had a free instant repair so you could truly get your money's worth. But that might break the servers (which is what is happening as I type this.) So they won't do that moreso for the safety of the game than anything else. But enough talk of why people are mad. As for refunds, i would like to ask if it is true, that if you get a refund, will your account be permanently banned. I ask because a few months ago an update accidentally broke Vega on older phones, and that various people got refunds for their coins. This question i know is risky, so if a mod feels the need to remove it, go ahead with a (sensitive topic) thingy o.o or just send it via some sort of private message. As much as I kyself **** about it, I'm not just gonna follow the flow just because I'm pissed off and want a refund. coughi'mlookingatyoucough

    Now. On to something that most likely won't happen, but this is my opinion. Nothing here is repevant unless the developers go "let's do this just for **** and giggles during april fools week!"

    In a chat with my friends, most of whom were mad ofc, we were discussing about the changes, and one of my friends laughed at ky suggestion, saying "lol she just wants to kill everything." But i felt they were good...pottentially good? Ideas so i felt the need to say them here.
    One of the main problems with the repairs is of how long these repair times are going to take, and for so little seemingly shield capacity. In looking at them, i saw how explosive shields had so much power, yet energy shields seemed to not have as kuch, while regen shields had low power and meta was kind of the beast. I won't explain it entirely, but this is how i feel things couod have been done.

    Regular shields, energy explosive and projectile based. These shields are the ones which carry us through many of the battles. Since they block 90% of damage, i feel they could have been changed so that at level five, energy shields have 4.75k (5.10k for bases) energy, explosive shields have 6k (6.5k for bases) energy, and projectile shields have 5.5k (5.8k for bases) energy.
    The reason for these h8gh values is because these shields are specified for just one type of damage, which means that for their specified kinds they would excell at protecting you. But if you come across anybody with say, phased projectiles for your ecplosive shields, you would no doubt suffer massive losses or entire destruction.

    Metaphase shields should stay at 80% resistance, or if for the best be raised to 90% as how it is being done now.

    Because these shields absorb all types of damage equally, for 80% they should have had about 5k (5.6 for bases) energy, and for 90% absorbtion, 4.75k (5.25k for bases) energy.
    As we all know, meta shields are all for 360% of protection whether you find yourself pinned down by a fleet of sico dreads, or surrounded by a bunch of motherfrigging annoying cutters with aurora rays or even thermal beams (god i hate those things s so kuch! XD) but that is also why i would keep energy levels low. Because unlike the specialized shields, which are jacked up to the max in one area, meta would serve to protect as much as possible. But as with priests who dabble in some of every magic class instead of focusing on healing or damage or poison or supportive, they aren't meant to last. Not much to change here.

    Regenerative shields. Possibly the most conflictive of all shields i have with up to date. I love them as much as i hate them. But there is definitely an edge to them which i feel isn't fulfilled in this and so many other games when it comes to this and many more games. You see, the energy modulators for shields (is that even a thing?) Are constantly pumping out energy to keep it around your ship. Once your ship deiez up, the shields fail, which is why they must be recharged before battle again. Fairly easy no? Now the probpem with regenerative shields that i have, is that the shields don't continuously recharge. These shield modulators, unlike the rest, are designed to keep pumping out more and more energy, and not just what you start with. An 80% protection is perfect and should stay like this, because it would be too powerful otherwise. What i felt was appropriate, was that shields be able to continuously recharge at rheir normal rates, but 50% while under fire, or even 25%. This is because of how fast regenerative shields seem to drop in battle, even amongst high level fleets. Once a ship can escape all forms of damage, its shields can begin to replenish normally once again, giving it an edge in case it is assaulted by an annoying fleet of....well not really cutters. But those are a pain.

    How i would see is that for level 5, energy regen shields would have 5k enervy, explosive regen would have 5.5k energy, and projectile shields have 5.2k energy. I haven't seen regen shields for bases, or i am just stupid so i am not including them. But as awesome as they would be, they'd more really just be useless since there are so many rush fleets that would bombard your base 24/7.

    Now for those of you who know me, or are just looking at this for whatever interest, you might be going "are you **** stupid?! Those would **** jack up the repairs even more!" Yes yes please put that gun away! Yes you too! Are we good?! Thank you! X_x; AHEM! now, as i understand...each point of energy and point of health is going to be one second of repair time. What i would have proposed, is that every two points of shield and health, or even three if i were extreme, were one second of repair time. This would at 2 seconds bring down the repairs back to what we had before, or make it even easier to repair. However, because weapons, specials and resistance tech will no longer have repair time, i would apply kt only to the shields, thereby keeping armor and health at 1 second repair, and shields at 2 points for one second.

    Bear with me I'm trying to address every flaw i can think of. Now...for the biggest, most **** ANNOYING THING I HAVE EVER HAD TO DEAL WITH.

    A few days ago....and a few weeks before that...and another few fore that....and again a few months ago (yes, i am a very, VERY angry person >8C #dealwithit ) i had the most wonderful pleasure, of my farming fleets being attacked by level 35 or such fleets. So what's the problem? Why cry about it and not attack them back? Well I would have. But you see the thing is...

    They were being protected. By level 50. To 55. Fleets. And you know what that means. I literally could not do **** jack **** for an entire day during conspiracy. SO! What's this **** proposing. Well, has anyone ever played star wars empire at war? (Forces of corruption was my version lol) well, usually, if you selected three units, say, basic troopers, rocket troopers, and a tank unit, or at-pt, you could slip into an enemy planet undetected and raid the surface directly. Or, you know, raid the planet like i did several times, be crushed repeatedly and forget that you had your **** **** armada camping the planet space...xD cue dropping everything and **** obliterating these fools....i swear too much. Ahem. What i propose, is that if a person tries to guard a level 35 to a 39 with a level 50 fleet, that the oposing player be able to attack the smaller fleet DIRECTLY provided that their fleet does not touch level 35. This would be because a level 34 and below are of course, legally unable to attack anything level 40 and above due to the five level difference. This would also be perfect as it would keep bullies or people just randomly attacking from keeping you from doing the events. I'm looking at a certain Russian alliance now....no not that one. The other one. Anyways, i have a final note. One that will either piss you off so hard, or make you squeal in joy.

    So you're level 35, minding your own business, happily taking up yojr cargo with your happy face when all of a sudden, you're attacked by a level 50 fleet! Oh noes! What do you do what do you do wjat do you do?! Well fear not! Each battle is only five minutes! What you must do, is avoid them entirely! Try to survive! The conditions could be, either at least one ship MUST survive even with only its final point of health, or, or, all yojr ships must survive. Whether undamaged or not. Either way, you fly, you speed, yoh zoom, and then! The clock reaches zero. What happens now? Well, either your fleet becomes immune, and go straight home. Well, you don't lose any res you may have, and probably save yourself some repair time. Or, or....oooorrrrrrr.....a super special event happens! Cue a cutscene! Or just, something happens with the barriers. If you were the person who attacked the low level fleet, level 35-40, and there is a gap of more than 10 levels, well...your entire fleet....is DESTROYED! either by massive destroyer ships spawning at the edge of the battle field and flying into your ships, destroying them instantly or with a few hits, or even say a massive spacial lazer warps in and opens fire on your fleet. In star wars lore, the expanded universe i think, there was a super weapon that fired a lazer of energy/light so fast, it could reach and destroy republic ships even if they were in hyperspace. I am not sure how correct i am, but this is my sinspiration for such an idea. But yeah, i wanna kill everything xD the only way this wouldn't work was if you yourself targeted and hit a fleet which was over ten levels above yours. This is so trolls can't get away with making high level fleet people miserable on purpose.

    So yeah. My reasoning as to why i feel so many players are upset, and suggestions as to what i feel could have been done to the game. I hope you at least get a nice laugh from my insane suggestions xD best of luck guys. I really hope the heat dies down soon and it turns out that this new game isn't so diffifult to play later c:

    Are you lost? Well don't worry. We'll take good care of you until you remember where you need to be. Please, don't be afraid to face your past. The only darkness that truly takes over our lives, is that which we allow ourselves to be consumed by.
  • ili1011
    Potential Threat
    Joined Jun 2015 Posts: 59

    We are not idiots!

    Don't dumb down the game!

    don't normalize the speed
    don't kill the diversity and the game
    Don't dumb down the game!
    Don't normalize the ships speed, Keep the diversity of ships!

    Exchange rate: 1 Black Amber = 1.097 Coins
    *Brought to you by KIXEYE VEGA Bank
    VEGA is Pay2Win!
    Remove Coins from the Black Market!
  • DK.Vibez
    Potential Threat
    Joined Nov 2014 Posts: 28
    Mr Kix Founder, just a quick question have you guys run a focus group,done a product test, have you released a beta of the update, you know let some of us test your updates let you know what we think, just a thought because in all honesty  this is not an update this vega con 2, it would be a good idea to allow some lower level and high level players test your new game, also because your essentially closing down the old game you should refund those who have spent money on hulls, you guys need to get some rules back in the workshop you know marketing product testing, Mr Kix you need to let new blood work you ideas are transparent and will only result in players having longer repair times, another thing, new players? how will attract them with these changes, the bar is much higher its going to be harder to keep new players if progress is so slow after having their fleets melted by 1 isc ship a few times, and when they see that they will have play for over a year to get that level you may not keep them for so long,so when your new players have left and your old ones have gone what will you be left with, you want new players to play and old ones to stay, you need more co-op a fairer attack system, and with the amount of ships you can build its over twice number the game started with you can lower the build times and have a seperate refitting bay, Mr Kix stop tinkering with vc and give it back to the talent let them do what their paid to do, because as your probably aware these new ideas are not to clever no matter how you sugar coat it, it will mean longer repairs times, months refitting ships,a severe disadvantage for those without isc hulls, fleets that have taken 52 days will be usless, carriers will be much less effective, and the last one which is quite important farming for events, bp's etc are going to be badly effected most of us rely on skill when hitting fleets and your rewarded by not having to spend every waking moment playing to complete events if after nearly two years of playing i have to go back to grinding out events i just wont bother, listen to your players we like the game and dont want to see it ruined with these changes

  • duzertozer
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Jul 2015 Posts: 244

    To you, the long time players, the game feels good as it is. It doesn’t feel broken or badly out of shape. You like playing the game - if you didn’t you wouldn’t have continued playing it month after month. And yet here am I saying it needs fixing. Well... we’re both right. As it turns out, you guys (and gals) are pretty unique. Out of the millions of people who have played VC, it really connected with a small, select subgroup of those people (you) who really enjoyed playing VC day after day, month after month. The majority of people didn’t find what they were looking for in VC and simply stopped playing. For those people, VC failed. It failed to be fun. It failed to be engaging day after day.

    And there lies the catch-22. Some of the aspects of the game that appeal to the current player base are the exact same aspects that frustrate or overload new players. To improve the experience for new players, and to grow VC, we have to alter the game to make it more attractive to new players. Sometimes, after considering all other options, this includes altering the game in a way that frustrates the current player base.

    This shows how out of touch things are. I don't think a single vet is overly happy with how things are, there are so many things that are broken that need fixing lol. the update just doesn't address any of the real problems. we love the game and want good well thought out updates to enhance the game, we are just saying its better now than what the proposed changes are bringing to the game. not to mention it is criminal to take money for items then change those items for the worse.
    If the development team actually listened to the veteran player base there would already be a game that new players like and stick with. Of course this game isn't for everyone, and the complexity of ships with different speeds isn't turning them away. Its simple things like too much build time, to much rep time, no refit bay, fleet bay being tedious to operate, ships that aren't consistent with usefulness compared to build time and rep.  coin deals that are mis-placed and only offered to certain groups, and the obvious pay to win lay out turns a lot of people off from the get go. 12yr olds notice that instantly. there is a long list of things that have nothing to do with the proposed changes that turn people off to this game, and certainly nothing in the new update that changes things to cater to the new player loyalty that i see.
    its really just the same old grind with different stats.

    I would have no problem with any of these changes if it was done fairly for everyone, and to be done fairly I believe it would take a full re-spec. If everyone's ships were converted to coins so everyone can start over on the same foot taking into account what they have built to date everyone would be happy and could rebuild their fleets in accordance with the new game stats without feeling ripped off or being forced to wait months to refit just to play the same game again.

    A re spec shouldn't be a problem especially if  "None of the changes are designed to make money, they are designed to improve the accessibility of the game by better defining the meta."  But we all know this is not true. and its insulting you say this. Your company is in business to make money the game has been created to make money. we accept this. we pay money to buy coins to play a fun game. we just want our $ to give us what we pay for. if thats a slap in the face at every update our money will go somewhere else.

    I do love this game and a full re-spec would make it right in my eyes. then together we can all move forward to creating a better game. Unfortunately the continuing lack of respect to the existing player base here has me rethinking my choice of games to put my time and $ into.

    I am a patient man. yes I will try the update, but unless something drastic happens that gives me a reason to believe Kix is on a different path and can actually be trusted to do right by their players and not say they are doing something we all want while full well knowing its something nobody really wants i cant allow myself put in the time and $ it will take to get back up to speed.  

    I will most likely be leaving after my current cache of coins runs out.

    Thanks for the fun,
    Please make an effort to win my trust back. My hopes are so low right now it wouldn't take much.

  • danking
    Potential Threat
    Joined Nov 2015 Posts: 97
    What is the point of this change?

    U only told us stupid things. New players? would be u so stupid for tell us it? really? come on, the game keep on live since all us still play it and spend time and coiner. And this update just **** new free players since they lost instant repair fleet. Do you know this game? have u ever play? we need give inspiration for new players and the inspiration is old good players since the new players will see and want be like them and have same weapons and hulls. 

    Now u only explain us since this game has been down from August.

    Who in the dev team came up with this? They should be fired/stabbed/[Insert terrible thing here]:

    The only thing than need be fixed is u be fired right now

    You’re dumbing down the game, I like complexity.

    The another stupid thing for u think about. Complexity has been done this game exciting. The different speeds increase the complexity and make u learn with your tiers hull.  The only good thing is may be new class of hull, maybe since come from u ...lol

    You’re only doing this for the money

    May be i believe than not since I can tell than u have stupid ideas. The main is not listen the community. The real players.

    How can I feel safe investing time/money into the game when you can just change everything in a heartbeat?

    U should do it better just give free and instant refit for all hull since them lost the main purpose. And another is not decrease hull just give more bonus for the hulls than need. It is simply or we need draw for u?

    The RESUME.

    Not change speed, not decrease mass just give more for ISC hull, give free instant refit for all hulls and fired yourself.

    The suggestion for make this game PVP and get more players and older come back:

    Tournament PVP with reward;
    Make pvp rank;
    Make win or lost medals with pvp fights dont only base attack;
    Make change on MK when u need only one central core for it and mk event give us the exactly tier than we are fight against;
    Just doing less farmaville and make the real fight game.

    Need more explanation?

    Add.. Give my money back   :P
  • Craig Blanton
    Craig Blanton
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Aug 2015 Posts: 388
    Paul, LXC, Scarlett: What are you guys doing? Ffs guys, stay away from the forums!

    Don't you guys know? Forum outrage is like a tire fire, the only thing you can do is stay away and wait for it to go out by itself. Try to put it out and you'll just make it worse or get yourself burned.
    You never cease to amaze and disgust in the same breathe, Craig.
  • Herpicus
    Joined Jul 2015 Posts: 23

    You wanna kill this game like Battle Pirates? Fine, I'll be killing every new player I see flying around making this Vega HELL for them.

    I won't be only focusing on fleets above level 35 anymore, I'll be crushing every single 19m+ ID player until they quit.

    Maybe you should consider listening to your player base and not some old fok that doesn't even play this game. Or maybe he does play and gets his **** handed to him every time he launches a fleet.


  • the mastadon
    the mastadon
    Master Tactician
    Joined Sep 2013 Posts: 2,132
    Paul, LXC, Scarlett: What are you guys doing? Ffs guys, stay away from the forums!

    Don't you guys know? Forum outrage is like a tire fire, the only thing you can do is stay away and wait for it to go out by itself. Try to put it out and you'll just make it worse or get yourself burned.
    If there is a "fire" every time you speak, you are doing something wrong. While I do understand the principle of that statement is to stop giving more information to the "fire" that is going on here, it should also be noted that these people have not stopped being pissed for this long. If anything it continues to develop into a more vibrant shade at an accelerated rate. These people have jobs to do, and frankly some of them have incredible balls for even showing up. Respect given. But there is still something to be said about being a continual bearer of bad news.
  • billybifocals
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Dec 2014 Posts: 743
    edited 10 Mar 2016, 12:29PM

    delete this

  • Elim Garak45
    Elim Garak45
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Nov 2015 Posts: 410
    As a newbie and as the changes are aimed at me here are my thoughts. If I am unable to use an instant repair fleet to farm for bp's or do events how can I progress? The game is bad enough having to live online to farm or do events to get anywhere. When you make the changes that will destroy any chance I have of moving forward and I think most newbies playing now will quit and those who join will not like the game and will not stay. Please do not make these changes, they won't work and we wil all leave losing you money and killing the game :-(
  • Krunkle Stien
    Krunkle Stien
    Joined Aug 2015 Posts: 12
    LoL...wow...I mean,just wow...How stupid do you think we are?....Congrats kixeye...you Killed VEGA!
  • Lightening
    Joined Mar 2016 Posts: 7
    I just simply want my money back! I bought upgrades. Now they are nerffed.
  • jeclough
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Apr 2015 Posts: 505

    I must give constructive thoughts in my reply:

    1. The "The Meta Rebalance" as a whole

    This is Kixeye trying to forge an existing game into a new one, at the expense of players with longevity and Money spent.  I can be considered a non coiner and have spent $40 in the almost 1 year of play.  I don't have dread fleets.  I don't have many apocs.  I don't have raptures.  I do have Heretics (1) and unlocked Vigilante and pythons (recent event).  These changes benefit me a lot, which is nice, and I am not suffering much loss.  So my opinion will be vastly different than someone who has spent more time and money in this game.  There has to be some kind of preservation on these players.  What will be done if <Insert Chinese character name> purchased the Dread MK upgrade special.  Well he (or she) will be very upset.  If you take away something that someone has earned, it is not right.

    Think of this game as an employer.  Can you take away your employees wages they earned over the last 3 years.  No, its not legal.  The same can be said about these players.  Because of the direct violation of real money, the players can VERY EASILY recoup their funds they spent on these purchases that are directly affected through Apple or Google.  I do not have a solution for this, I do not get paid for it, you guys do.  You guys figure that one out.  Coins to those effected?

    2. Repair times.

    These changes are not so bad.  The player base is skeptical.  They even looked at ways around the rep time and found the venom to be the perfect glass cannon.  Then Kixeye added 60 HP to it, so they took that away O.O  .  What we as players will always see, is that change is bad.  It always is.  What has become the norm, is what we have accepted.  When we see that we are losing abilities, but gaining in other areas, we will be sure to identify the losses before the gains, its normal as a human.  We wanted a holistic reduction in repair times, but this was because some fucktard can come along and ruin my entire event because he hits my only level 50 fleet because he finished it in 1 day.  Now I cant play until tomorrow.....and guess what, hes back out there doing it again.  It was also because when we are at war, we want to play the game.  Its the most invigorating part of the game.  We want to kill ****.  When we lose all of our PVP fleets, we are done fighting for DAYS (12-15 hours per fleet).  This makes it to where wars are waged between long term end gamers or coiners, and pretty much everyone else takes a back seat.

    3. Kixeye Founder/Dev Post

    We don't need a huge backstory on what Vega was to be.  Many players left your other game battle pirates because of its crap, and to strut around showing off your involvement in that game was actually not beneficial.  We love this game for what it is, not what it can be.  Changes were needed, and players have voiced their opinions on what those are.  These changes are in the mix, but there is so much more that negates those changes.

    4. Fleet Bay 11

    This is the final prize.  Something the player base has asked for.  They have received it!  YES!!!  But wait a minute.  If we take a look at what this means, its actually quite annoying.  With the nerf/buff of ship masses, its obvious that ISC is the new end game fleets.  The purpose of these ships is to have RIDICULOUS amounts of armor.  That same armor that adds repair time.  Which can be expected.  But the reduction of fire power, is where the problem lies.  Lets look at the python.  With 8500 Max Mass, and only 3 weapon slots, it has the MAXIMUM ability to hold 3 "viable" weapons at about 3k mass.  Add on a tier 3 special Ionized Optics, 4 x Zynthium 5 (Heaviest), Metaphase 3 shield (heaviest) and it is still shy 468 Tons from maximum mass.  Lets now upgrade this thing to MK5 (hypothetical) and add 1 more Zynthium 5.  Its mass is now 8k, where its maximum mass is 10,200.  that is 2,200 unused mass that is lost, ALWAYS.  Although this was a good idea, it was pointless.  What we need is HIGHER modules in addition to this. i.e. Zynthium 6.

    There is just to much to think about, and people are tired of trying to change Kixeyes mind.  Instead of feeding some information to us, why don't you unveil the breakdown of EVERYTHING, including future thoughts.  for example, LXC stated that the next release will have a build time change ( I know the heretic will not be 4 days anymore....) but did not give us specific changes.  This can be done for everything!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • defel67
    Potential Threat
    Joined Nov 2015 Posts: 25

    I will preface by saying that I am a level 45 mobile player. Also understand that I usually find all of the complaining and whining on these forums to be in bad taste and would not be a part of it. Unfortunately I feel that I need to share a few thoughts on the new rebalance:

    People, myself included, have spent real money for your special offers for mark upgrades in the past couple months. The most recent upgrades I can remember are the Ragnorok Carrier up to mark 5 for $50 (receiving a large speed nerf making it's agility field unusable as your ships will fly out of it in the first moments of battle and it will be destroyed), the Dread Battleship upgrade to mark 5 for $50 (received one of the largest buffs for weight and now is no more agile than any other battleship in the game, barley more than a fury now) Mark 5 upgrade for Zeal Battleships $50 (Zeals were the fast and most agile battleship, now they are once again nerfed to a speed of the rancor with slightly more mass. than a fury) $50 dollars for Mark 5 Komodo cutters, one the fastest cutters in the game (now no faster than any other cutter and with the crazy merc Mark upgrades it will be easily dominated by the way more powerful python. The Valkary carrier Mark 5 for $50 dollars. (Just like the Rag, speeds have been cut to the point that for its mass it won't be much factor in the game) The lance destroyer Mark 5 upgrade for $50 dollars. Once the best, most heavily armed strafing cutter in the game for basing, now just on par with all other destroyers just better at our and weapons. And the Condor frigate Mark 5 for $50 (I didn't get this because it is widely thought of as a garbage frame without armor and kixeye's move to make shields useless have really made it unusable, but it actually received a buff) I hope you seriously consider adjusting build times for these frames as they are now nothing special at all. 14 days for a zeal was insane, and now just doesn't make sense.

    We were sold products, that all for different reasons were the best in the game for what they did for a lot of money. Granted we received coins with these offers, but for a lot of us the marks were the big selling point because they gave us an edge in PVP. We are suddenly being told that the Ferrari we were sold a mere months ago is now being exchanged for a base model mustang. The frames look cool, but perform only slightly better than a Toyota Corolla. Kixeye markets Vega as a game for hardcore gamers and recent reports show that vega gamers spend money on the game,per individual player, in a massive order of magnitude to other pay to play games. Be prepared to see a sharp falloff in revenue from top players, the players who do most of this spending. I for one will probably be one of them.

    What is going to happen to the vega and vsec ships we have to grind for events? You say that you are gearing the game to be more focused on firepower than armor and shields to focus on PVP, but the amount of armor, range, and firepower that you put on AI ships is insane and means that you can not go toe to toe with them without using speed, range, and good piloting. To make matters worse shields now have repair time, which intern means that you don't have that buffer for your armor to allow short repair times so that you can complete these events when battling vsec/vega/merc ships. How are you going to address this? I for one will not be coining massive repair bills to farm vega for events and tech.

    You say you are doing this to attract newer players to stay in the game, which is great. Unfortunately the method you are going about doing this is really slapping the loyal players in the face(most of which are the ones who have made Kixeye very profitable) From a business standpoint there are better ways to do the things you have set out to do that you could show some form of appreciation for your most loyal consumers while providing a good path to make weaker players stronger. I don't know if you are really getting this, because a lot of people whine and complain constantly on these forums, but there are a lot of very angry people who have been your loyal customers who feel betrayed right now. In fact it feels like an intensional disincentive for all our money, time, and loyalty. If there is not some form of show of appreciation for top players, I think you can plan on seeing some familiar tags disappearing from vega. Many players that have been with you since the beginning feel betrayed and sold out. You should prepare for a backlash. I hope that you achieve your goal of getting newer players to stop dropping out.

    Thank you for your time,

  • Pavegunner
    Joined Jun 2015 Posts: 17
    edited 9 Mar 2016, 9:06PM
    @CM LXC  Please let Paul know that there are some of us that truly appreciate Paul's attempt at addressing the player's concerns but I fear this only adds fuel to the fire.

    There are people (actual players of the game) that have suggested some pretty great things (base speed determined by tier rather than class, T4 MK upgrade providing faction bonuses i.e. ISC health/VSEC speed) that compromise between what is planned and what the players are most upset about.  Again, I do believe that change is necessary to keep the game alive and moving forward even if it makes some people irritated or upset.  I realize you and Scarlett are meant to be the bridge between the community and Kixeye Devs/Management however I suggest that select players be given an opportunity to have a no BS discussion with Kixeye regarding the direction of the game.  A couple of people on the top of my list is DoW and Top Gear.  These guys have invested time and money in playing the game as well as creating resources/tools that have become staples of the community and dare I say have helped in VCs success.  I think they have a good understanding of everything involved and if something drastic needs to happen then why not give the player base a voice so that we can actually work together to ensure both of our needs (kix: profit, players: enjoyment) are satisfied?.  Not saying you and Scarlett aren't advocating for us (I am sure you are) but I fear certain non-constructive comments devalue the majority/most important concerns raised and to be blunt (I obviously don't know your management) I think they can speak their minds more freely.

    You’re only doing this for the money:This specific set of changes will most likely lose us money in the short term. We know we’ve lost the confidence of players by moving the goalposts and it will take time to rebuild it. None of the changes are designed to make money, they are designed to improve the accessibility of the game by better defining the meta.

    Paul contradict's himself in this response.  If not doing it for the money, then why do you care to expand accessibility/play-ability to a wider number of players?  The answer is an expanded player base means an increase in the number of possible players that will buy coin and in the end increasing profit.  So, yes it is about the money but there is nothing wrong with that as far as I am concerned.  We don't have this game to play unless it provides Kixeye with a profit.  It is actually in our (the players) best interest that Kixeye makes a profit so we can continue to play the game we have come to love and before I get piked I am only speaking to the desire by Kixeye to expand its player base i.e. changes to the game.  I do not defend the MK offer situations, in my eyes those were clearly unethical
    (fraudulent? maybe but I am not a lawyer).    

    I guess the whole point of this is to say that you, Kixeye, need to find a better way to compromise with your current player base otherwise you will be dependent on finding a completely new base that will be willing to pay.  I am a very casual coiner however when it comes to mobile games (I play VC on all platforms) there isn't any other I have spent more money on.  My time is a valuable resource (married, young children, full-time job, full-time student) and I don't get a ton of it to play games these days but I love VC. These changes have however discouraged me to the point  where I have just purchased a different game to spent my time on.  I will still be around (mobile version) to see how things shake out but I just wanted describe an example of the lost opportunities Kixeye will be/is experiencing by moving forward with the update regardless to the reaction of the community at large.  

  • scholt
    Joined Oct 2015 Posts: 16
    So the Root of this is:

    [...] mobile, some not so much. [...] And this is where we catch up to today, or rather five months ago, when KIXEYE started to put some serious thought into addressing the areas of VC that were not working well.

    uhm, eh, so this whole rebalance originated from addressing the stuff which doesn't work that well on mobile? The thing is, almost everyone I talked to had much problems with connection drops on the mobile versions. So for engaging mobile player into PvP, I think there might be room for improvements? But ok, you might have the exact data on this and it could only be a problem for me. (yes I contacted support about this, we did the ping-check and they told me to contact my ISP about issues, but honestly I don't expect much outcome of this because with other games and anything I don't have problems).

    Anyway, on Steam everything works pretty well. But this speed thing is just frustrating, there is not really any reason to not build the highest version of a shipclass. And after spending the last three months grinding all those events and riots, it's frustrating, because I would have taken other decisions if I knew about the speed ****.

  • pflernak
    Potential Threat
    Joined Feb 2015 Posts: 47

    I still didn't see any real explaintion in that at all...

    At least you got some lip service. Thank you for making the game a success. Its sad that youre going to quit but you know fresh money ... I mean blood.
    "Well she turned me into a newt . . .  I got better."
  • dom.friant
    Force to be Reckoned With
    Joined Sep 2014 Posts: 1,995
    I wish I could get an answer from him to this question:
    The player community, both long time players and new ones, PC and mobile, almost universally say they do not want the proposed speed changes, and are begging you not to implement them. Does that not give you pause to reconsider or re-think this change?
    Because I like the Condor!
  • Dirty Mix
    Dirty Mix
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Oct 2013 Posts: 787
    M16 A4 said:
    Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.

    Not this time, Mr. Preece.
    well, this is not the second time kixeye pull some shameful shady tactics.
  • mason.dixen
    Master Tactician
    Joined Oct 2013 Posts: 2,156
    Dirty Mix said:
    M16 A4 said:
    Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.

    Not this time, Mr. Preece.
    well, this is not the second time kixeye pull some shameful shady tactics.
    I would have to go back and count.  I really just want to play my game and not have to hear, Mason go to forums and check this out.  And then since I know what this will mean, I fight against most of it.  Like I said before, everything by the speed change I can live and adjust too.  Why? Becuase with the focus moving from PvE to PvP

    The critical factor is we really haven't had any new content.  That isn't important as long as we can progress this game where its accessible to all players, with or without wallets. 
    "Forged in the flames of the original 8k wars"
    "Participant in the Jova Crusades; the winning side"
    "I hate cargo fleets.  What else do you want me to say"
    "I attacked you because you stole my piece of cheesecake with cherry toppings."
    "The government has ordered me to harvest this farm.  Please be patient as your base is harvested."
    IGN: MasonD
    ~Condolences to all who share a similar name - there can only be one.
  • Fajar Priyanto
    Fajar Priyanto
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Nov 2014 Posts: 335

    @Herpicus said:
    You wanna kill this game like Battle Pirates? Fine, I'll be killing every new player I see flying around making this Vega HELL for them.

    I won't be only focusing on fleets above level 35 anymore, I'll be crushing every single 19m+ ID player until they quit.

    Maybe you should consider listening to your player base and not some old fok that doesn't even play this game. Or maybe he does play and gets his **** handed to him every time he launches a fleet.


    This is awesome idea. I'll do that too.

  • Livn Lern
    Livn Lern
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Jul 2015 Posts: 326
    1. Would you consider extending the free refit policy to all ships currently built instead of just the ones rendered completely inoperable? Many players will save time refitting and be able to play effectively sooner if you did.
    2. Would you consider a free ISC ship carepackage from ISC to the rebels due to "low manpower after the fight with VEGA"? Even if only to players over level 40 or 45... as a level 32, I would not benefit much but my alliance mates surely would and it might go some small distance as an apology for the betrayal much of your long time player base is feeling right now. It seems that the message you are sending is that new players who have yet to show much loyalty or garanteed interest in the game are more important than old players that have been playing this game year after year, paying enough to obviously keep it a successful business venture and a few ISC ships of the player's choice would make it more worthwhile to stick around and at least give the rebalance a try.
    3. Is there ANY thought of reducing the range or effects of "autohit" weapons or maybe reducing the width of the battleship's firing arcs slightly so they can't cover each other quite as well, giving purpose to other ships to protect their flanks? I feel that is killing the skill base in this game far more than any speeds. Equiping weapons that never miss on a bunch of battleships and upping the rotation speeds slightly seems to be the best counter to anything with speed and ironically enough, every ship that relies on speed you've just made purposely the "counter" to just those kinds of ships that can easily spin around and autohit to their heart's content for massive damage. Maybe a deflection or defussion system for glancing blows while shields of the right type are up? Just something to stop the "pyriahic victory" effect of using really any sort of ships against battleships that seems to happen unless you've dumped every ounce of armor you have on your ships at which point you're punished in repair time anyway. I'm pretty sure only a well set up destroyer fleet can hope to counter that and that's because net torp assisted destroyers is pretty much the actual hard counter to battleships.
  • Frank Freda
    Frank Freda
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Sep 2015 Posts: 152

    Politics is the art of appearing candid while revealing as little as possible. Thank you for invalidating the past year.

  • pflernak
    Potential Threat
    Joined Feb 2015 Posts: 47
    edited 9 Mar 2016, 10:45PM
    CM LXC said:
    Some aspects of the original PC game work well on mobile, some not so much.
    I started this game on a tablet and later (after many months) moved to PC. I had no problem with ship stats but with the controls and frequently losing the connection (while sitting next to my wifi router mind you). And to be honest its impossible to provide the same amount of control on a touch screen that a mouse and keyboard can offer.
    CM LXC said:
    Bringing more consistency to hull speeds should return more complexity than it takes as the number of meaningful stats increases. Over time, we expect more hull classes to become useful to more players.
    Yes some hulls will become useful others will loose some of it. However having slightly different clones of the same thing does not add any complexity to the game.

    What youre planning is a clear linear hull progression. Aside from the ISC hulls and Carrier support fields the only difference will be in Hull HP and mass. Can that really be called variety?

    To have variety we should be getting sidegrades instead of the planned upgrade model.
    Examples of variety in of hulls of the same class:
    -range bonus for speed penalty (These 2 should always be the inverse of each other.)
    -larger firing arcs for more unusable hull mass
    -more strafing speed than forward speed (but less than other ships of the class have forward speed)

    CM LXC said:
    The hull repair change will significantly shift the meta of ship design towards lower armor, high damage ships. As it does ship repair times will fall.

    Yet the strongest ships will have more armor and less weapon slots.

    A couple of the ISC hulls (Python and Machete) will have so much mass that using current components it cant even be fully utilized. At least not while equipping any practical weapons. This does not give me the impression that the changes have been well thought through.
    CM LXC said:
    We are planning on providing some assistance to players to help them adjust their equipment to the new meta.
    Free refits for only the ships that become overweight is too little assistance after turning everything on its head. Especially when most shields receive a mass reduction and most ships a mass boost - reducing the number of said free refits.

    I see this as forcing players to spend an unreasonably long time refitting their fleets or to buy coins to do it. We need free refits for all ships that currently utilize more than lets say 50% of their hull mass. Or we need to be compensated in coins. Lets say 80% of the coins it would take to instantly fit everything thats already on our ships.
    CM LXC said:
    You’re only doing this for the money:

    This specific set of changes will most likely lose us money in the short term. We know we’ve lost the confidence of players by moving the goalposts and it will take time to rebuild it. None of the changes are designed to make money, they are designed to improve the accessibility of the game by better defining the meta.

    Lets be honest a companies purpose is to earn profit for its owners. What youre planning will loose you old players and money in the short term. Perhaps you dont really care about old players as they likely spend less coins than new ones. After all they already have most of the tech and multiple high tier fleets.

    So youre betting on fresh blood that will be unaware of how you treated us the old players.

    If things go the way they look they are going to go at the moment Im likely going to quit this game and be **** sure to give a rating and a review reflecting your treatment and attitude towards your players. Potential future players deserve to be warned.
    "Well she turned me into a newt . . .  I got better."
  • ChuckBukkit
    Potential Threat
    Joined Nov 2015 Posts: 39
    edited 10 Mar 2016, 5:22AM

    Hey forumites and Kixarians!!!!  Whatz this rumour I hear that Kix will retire Vega Conflict by the end of the year?  Is this a last ditched attempt to squeeze a few more bucks out of the punters before yas put the shutters up?? 

    Talk to me Kix.  Talk to me.


    @CMLXC @CM_LXC @LEX Yo dude, Lex, Lexter, Lexman - ya missed my question?? 

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