Have you lost your mind. ? new special breakdown.

  • Weresquirrel
    Weresquirrel
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Sep 2011 Posts: 9,977
    edited 21 Aug 2013, 7:28PM
    Furthermore, the base guarding fleet hasn't really been taken into consideration in these viewpoints (even if you don't include the Guardian); so yes, you'll do more damage to buildings and turrets, but you'll still be getting hit by the base guarding fleet - Siege Targeting has no beneficial effect to these ships.
    Okay let's talk about that.  The usual logic of base defense is to force an attacker to stop at the Cerbs so that the long range weapons in the center island and the ship weapons have more time to do their work.  This is especially true of players who rely heavily on researchable technologies.  You point out that ships aren't affected as if that were news.  Some of us have already crunched the numbers based on DPS of various offensive builds, the resistances and hit points of our platforms, and the DPS of our long range weapons and defensive ships.  

    Siege Targeting does affect the defensive fleet, just not as directly.  Let's say a player uses ship based mortars on defense and for simplicity's sake we'll say they do that with hulls and mortars that are already available, leaving out the Guardian and the new mortar.  When the Cerbs die faster that defensive fleet becomes proportionately less effective.  That outcome is inevitable.  And it's going to take a lot of refitting for a player who runs that type of defense to even partially compensate for that setback.

    So either there are undisclosed stats on these new specials or else the Kixeye team is underestimating how much the players are taking into consideration.  Would you have a look at Schmee's update, perhaps?  
  • Max Last
    Max Last
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Nov 2011 Posts: 3,254
    Back to my exact same spot:  Tower west, sector 7. coords 3631,461
  • Michigan Marauder
    Michigan Marauder
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Jun 2011 Posts: 2,787
    @ Max 
    I have already seen shock Qs take out that ship in around 12 seconds, while it was blowing up other things. they don't have to stop so you take 1 offensive ship out of the mix on your base and it means trouble.
    Tired of closed threads and over moderation, join a new forum where conversation is welcomed
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    WoW Alpha Tester

    Holy crap I need to get my eyes checked.  I thought you had typed, "Will we see midget strippers dancing on our whorehouses?"

    Sarcasm and jadedness is all we have left - everything else costs Uranium now. -Grumpy Pirate

  • MagicSarap
    MagicSarap
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Sep 2012 Posts: 5,522
    Lise said:
    Furthermore, the base guarding fleet hasn't really been taken into consideration in these viewpoints (even if you don't include the Guardian); so yes, you'll do more damage to buildings and turrets, but you'll still be getting hit by the base guarding fleet - Siege Targeting has no beneficial effect to these ships.
    Okay let's talk about that.  The usual logic of base defense is to force an attacker to stop at the Cerbs so that the long range weapons in the center island and the ship weapons have more time to do their work.  This is especially true of players who rely heavily on researchable technologies.  You point out that ships aren't affected as if that were news.  Some of us have already crunched the numbers based on DPS of various offensive builds, the resistances and hit points of our platforms, and the DPS of our long range weapons and defensive ships.  

    Siege Targeting does affect the defensive fleet, just not as directly.  Let's say a player uses ship based mortars on defense and for simplicity's sake we'll say they do that with hulls and mortars that are already available, leaving out the Guardian and the new mortar.  When the Cerbs die faster that defensive fleet becomes proportionately less effective.  That effect is inevitable.  And it's going to take a lot of refitting for a player who runs that type of defense to even partially compensate for that setback.

    So either there are undisclosed stats on these new specials or else the Kixeye team is underestimating how much the players are taking into consideration.  Would you have a look at Schmee's update, perhaps?  
    Sure, could you provide me the link? Also, on the topic of the defense fleet scenario; I'm not sure what ships you're using or what the loadouts are, but while the Cerbs may take more damage, fleets will have a lower survivability if you've swapped Siege Targeting in place of another utility special - losing any additional damage protection or evade they may have had.
  • Max Last
    Max Last
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Nov 2011 Posts: 3,254
    @ Max 
    I have already seen shock Qs take out that ship in around 12 seconds, while it was blowing up other things. they don't have to stop so you take 1 offensive ship out of the mix on your base and it means trouble.
    If you mean the assault missile one, that was actually more for sniping/preping bases than a guard.  As a guard I'd do anything else.  MCX and save the weight mostly.  65% reload 6 x 1.65= DPS  equivalentt to 9.9 weapon slots, saves 2k tons for the same firepower and similar defensive profile.
    Back to my exact same spot:  Tower west, sector 7. coords 3631,461
  • Michigan Marauder
    Michigan Marauder
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Jun 2011 Posts: 2,787
    I still believe Kixeye is going to do something, that will set the game right for the high end. The low end players are even more **** as they don't have halos, blue waffle stun guns, or the menace of the jav breathing fire. When I asked Magic Sarap has Missions and Raids replaced research several months ago....He said there would be new things coming. 

    I am not sure if he was indicating we will have some new stuff to research, new blue prints we could find, new technology, but at some point the gap between the haves and the have nots with raid inflation hardness is growing at leaps and bounds. I guess we will all have to wait and see how it plays out
    Tired of closed threads and over moderation, join a new forum where conversation is welcomed
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    WoW Alpha Tester

    Holy crap I need to get my eyes checked.  I thought you had typed, "Will we see midget strippers dancing on our whorehouses?"

    Sarcasm and jadedness is all we have left - everything else costs Uranium now. -Grumpy Pirate

  • Michael Sunday
    Michael Sunday
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Aug 2011 Posts: 129
    here magic is that link .... http://www.feralland.com/bp/ look for your self  at dps and start crunching the numbers your self   and see what you come up with  maybe our math skills is defferant then kixeyes?

    sog
  • Michigan Marauder
    Michigan Marauder
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Jun 2011 Posts: 2,787

    Sure, could you provide me the link? Also, on the topic of the defense fleet scenario; I'm not sure what ships you're using or what the loadouts are, but while the Cerbs may take more damage, fleets will have a lower survivability if you've swapped Siege Targeting in place of another utility special - losing any additional damage protection or evade they may have had.
    I dont have to lose anything on the DNX build.....I switch out counter measure for siege targeting. I am not saying it is the end of the world for upper levels, but I still stand by lower levels without the halo, jav, or the stun turret are more readily made into farms.
    Tired of closed threads and over moderation, join a new forum where conversation is welcomed
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    WoW Alpha Tester

    Holy crap I need to get my eyes checked.  I thought you had typed, "Will we see midget strippers dancing on our whorehouses?"

    Sarcasm and jadedness is all we have left - everything else costs Uranium now. -Grumpy Pirate

  • vetehinen
    vetehinen
    Master Tactician
    Joined Dec 2011 Posts: 2,232
    edited 21 Aug 2013, 7:48PM
    Can i seriously ask you who dreamed up this idea. this is beyond a joke. the new mortars were pushing it but this is a giant leap over board. i just did some rough calculations on your new siege special. this is for 1 weapon per ship.

    Triton using shock q, building damage per volley 1800

    Triton using siege b, building damage per volley 8000

    Triton using siege rocket s, Building damage per round 2150

    DNX using siege b, building damage per volley, 5600

    DNX using shock q, building damage per volley, 1050

    scx using siege cannon z, building damage per shot, 1683.5

    MCX using siege missile F, building damage per shot, 1575,

    Thresher using siege rocket s, building damage per round, 1505

    thresher using maelstrom v, building damage per round, 2870

    this is without using rogue crews for critical hits.

    You can not be serious kixeye. i refuse to believe a competent person has thought this through. do you want your game to end. because this will totally destroy you game. this is by far the worse idea i have ever seen from you. no base in this game will hold up after these specials are released. period. and if you want to question my statement let me put this to you.
    You put me in a test server now with any single member from your dev team, allow me to construct the needed fleets and then put any base you want in front of me and i will smoke it. i challenge anyone in your company to design a base i cant break with this new special...

    so before you try to tell me i am wrong and we need to adapt first show me. this is stupid. its beyond stupid its **** ridiculous.

    I am shocked at how bad this really is and how bad of a negative impact this will have on the game, im shocked that a company of your stature would design this and consider for release. Im totally gob smacked. I would like some answers as to why kixeye feel this is a good release and why something so stupidly over powered has been released.
    Like i said when seen preview leak video ... not good event 

    Brief seem to have other type of base set ups but still a " time to find new game "

    And testing one just now ... there you can launch fleets when outside of your base ... still some things is better in BP but not lot !

    is that 75 % bonus strait on ... triton 75 % bonus + special bonus 75 % = 150 % base damage ? ... can some one tell me what we do with bases now ? 

    Not waiting for event and new super goli with 3 special more weapons and build in def bonus ... and if i cant get to tier 5 prize with no coins 

    ... do you really need to ask ... i will tell everyone kixeye aint worth any coin at all ! 

    When id 400 k range over lvl 60 player with near all toys wont get to tier 5 anymore  GAME OVER ... there been 1 event like that 

    this is strike 2 .... at strike 3 its your out ... will be hard after 2 1/2 year but done that to other games too 
  • Dirty_Nightmare
    Dirty_Nightmare
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Mar 2012 Posts: 203
    edited 21 Aug 2013, 7:49PM
    calculate it too dps cause you cant be right on avarge dmg it was the same thing when the javelin camed out alot people thougth it was overpowerd but when you calculatet it too dps sents and howies was alot stronger than the jav was
    Lv 56
    BP name Dirty_Nightmare
    Hulls won evry hull since BI4
    Alliance: Killers at sea
    AofD,QYC,POW,BIO

  • Killzonek
    Killzonek
    Potential Threat
    Joined Aug 2012 Posts: 89
    Lise said:
    Furthermore, the base guarding fleet hasn't really been taken into consideration in these viewpoints (even if you don't include the Guardian); so yes, you'll do more damage to buildings and turrets, but you'll still be getting hit by the base guarding fleet - Siege Targeting has no beneficial effect to these ships.
    Okay let's talk about that.  The usual logic of base defense is to force an attacker to stop at the Cerbs so that the long range weapons in the center island and the ship weapons have more time to do their work.  This is especially true of players who rely heavily on researchable technologies.  You point out that ships aren't affected as if that were news.  Some of us have already crunched the numbers based on DPS of various offensive builds, the resistances and hit points of our platforms, and the DPS of our long range weapons and defensive ships.  

    Siege Targeting does affect the defensive fleet, just not as directly.  Let's say a player uses ship based mortars on defense and for simplicity's sake we'll say they do that with hulls and mortars that are already available, leaving out the Guardian and the new mortar.  When the Cerbs die faster that defensive fleet becomes proportionately less effective.  That effect is inevitable.  And it's going to take a lot of refitting for a player who runs that type of defense to even partially compensate for that setback.

    So either there are undisclosed stats on these new specials or else the Kixeye team is underestimating how much the players are taking into consideration.  Would you have a look at Schmee's update, perhaps?  
    Sure, could you provide me the link? Also, on the topic of the defense fleet scenario; I'm not sure what ships you're using or what the loadouts are, but while the Cerbs may take more damage, fleets will have a lower survivability if you've swapped Siege Targeting in place of another utility special - losing any additional damage protection or evade they may have had.
    More Damage to the cerbs ?.... They are gone in one volly lol What if i take hull streamline off my DNX Magic am i losing anything then ?.... No i lose nothing and gain 75% building damage so tell me how am i lowering my fleet survivability ?.....
  • Captain Blood
    Captain Blood
    Greenhorn
    Joined Dec 2011 Posts: 14
    Maybe a new level 3 shipyard is on horizon as well???
  • vetehinen
    vetehinen
    Master Tactician
    Joined Dec 2011 Posts: 2,232
    Heavy fleet 

    2 ships 2 DNX 8 siege B mortar + special = 44 800 damage per salvo with splash of 30 its every thing down 2 land tiles away from hit point 

    You hit base guard in channel only 2 water block wide it will blow all out from inner island too  ... there is videos of this on you tube wiith no + 75 % damage bonus !

    2 ships 2 tritons 8 siege B mortars + special = 64 000 damage from one salvo ... what has that much armor points in base ? 


  • bruce_lee
    bruce_lee
    Force to be Reckoned With
    Joined Jun 2012 Posts: 1,735
    edited 21 Aug 2013, 8:09PM

    Sure, could you provide me the link? Also, on the topic of the defense fleet scenario; I'm not sure what ships you're using or what the loadouts are, but while the Cerbs may take more damage, fleets will have a lower survivability if you've swapped Siege Targeting in place of another utility special - losing any additional damage protection or evade they may have had.
    Taking out turrets faster also increases survivability by keeping you stopped less. Trading one special out is not a problem and will not have much impact. Mortars are not the only thing our bases have to guard against.
  • Dirty_Nightmare
    Dirty_Nightmare
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Mar 2012 Posts: 203
    edited 21 Aug 2013, 8:07PM
    Can i seriously ask you who dreamed up this idea. this is beyond a joke. the new mortars were pushing it but this is a giant leap over board. i just did some rough calculations on your new siege special. this is for 1 weapon per ship.

    Triton using shock q, building damage per volley 1800

    Triton using siege b, building damage per volley 8000

    Triton using siege rocket s, Building damage per round 2150

    DNX using siege b, building damage per volley, 5600

    DNX using shock q, building damage per volley, 1050

    scx using siege cannon z, building damage per shot, 1683.5

    MCX using siege missile F, building damage per shot, 1575,

    Thresher using siege rocket s, building damage per round, 1505

    thresher using maelstrom v, building damage per round, 2870

    this is without using rogue crews for critical hits.

    You can not be serious kixeye. i refuse to believe a competent person has thought this through. do you want your game to end. because this will totally destroy you game. this is by far the worse idea i have ever seen from you. no base in this game will hold up after these specials are released. period. and if you want to question my statement let me put this to you.
    You put me in a test server now with any single member from your dev team, allow me to construct the needed fleets and then put any base you want in front of me and i will smoke it. i challenge anyone in your company to design a base i cant break with this new special...

    so before you try to tell me i am wrong and we need to adapt first show me. this is stupid. its beyond stupid its **** ridiculous.

    I am shocked at how bad this really is and how bad of a negative impact this will have on the game, im shocked that a company of your stature would design this and consider for release. Im totally gob smacked. I would like some answers as to why kixeye feel this is a good release and why something so stupidly over powered has been released.




    i can tell you one thing dps of triton b with targeting 3 is 548 and shreder on it without tageting is 513 dps
    Lv 56
    BP name Dirty_Nightmare
    Hulls won evry hull since BI4
    Alliance: Killers at sea
    AofD,QYC,POW,BIO

  • Max Last
    Max Last
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Nov 2011 Posts: 3,254
    edited 21 Aug 2013, 8:13PM
    vetehinen said:
    Heavy fleet 

    2 ships 2 DNX 8 siege B mortar + special = 44 800 damage per salvo with splash of 30 its every thing down 2 land tiles away from hit point 

    You hit base guard in channel only 2 water block wide it will blow all out from inner island too  ... there is videos of this on you tube wiith no + 75 % damage bonus !

    2 ships 2 tritons 8 siege B mortars + special = 64 000 damage from one salvo ... what has that much armor points in base ? 


    We knew this a year ago when DNX first ruled the seas.  If you've forgotten this and designed bases with this vulnerability in the meantime I simply have no words to describe your complaint.

    As for your last question, I think it's a very good one.  Why would you be so stupid as to build a fleet wasting 50% of it's firepower, especially one that can be completely shut down by a single bombard and 4 Hail C.  Ignoring the fact that it would then time out trying to kill a single explosive resistance Goliath or Thresher.

    ETA:  It really isn't so much the 'OMG SKY IS FALLING LOLJK ITS MORTARDAMURUNG' that really irritates me, it's the outright stupidity of some of the examples you people are using.

    More Damage to the cerbs ?.... They are gone in one volly lol What if i take hull streamline off my DNX Magic am i losing anything then ?.... No i lose nothing and gain 75% building damage so tell me how am i lowering my fleet survivability ?.....
    Replacing hull streamline with siege equipment, eh?  Lost nothing, eh?  So, what orifice did you pull the extra 17% weapon weight from?
    Back to my exact same spot:  Tower west, sector 7. coords 3631,461
  • Ultros
    Ultros
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Aug 2013 Posts: 606
    edited 21 Aug 2013, 8:19PM
    Let me put Sarap's argument about the mort fleets with Siege Special losing defense properties to rest for good:

    1. My base has NEVER been taken by a DN X fleet, and quite many enemies have tried. Today this changed.
    2. An enemy attacked me with a 3 DN X fleet with 4 Siege Mort B on each ship.
    3. To build such a fleet, you have to sacrifice defensive capabilities.
    4. The fleet killed my turrets in seconds, and the splash finished off almost all nearby def ships as well (and my def fleet has high expl defense).
    5. This was "just" Siege B, obviously WITHOUT the Siege Targetting special.

    CONCLUSION: Siege Mort B/Shockwave Q and Siege Targetting special overcome ANY KIND of base defense. They kill turrets so fast that long-range turrets barely have a chance to hit them. Def fleet gets killed via splash and hardly necessitates additional stops. Attacking fleets running such a set-up can forego defensive boni because they simply kill bases so quickly they hardly get hit. THIS IS A DEFINITIVE UNBALANCE.

    SOLUTION: The immediate release of the improved Draconian Bombard. Lower the damage value of Siege Targetting, or bin the whole idea for the time being. Siege Mort B and Shockwave Q should carry weight penalties.
    With Kixeye often using the words "we're aware of that problem" interchangeably with "we'll utterly ignore it", I wonder if they got both terms mixed up to such an extent that they have internally coined the neologisms "ignoreness" and "awarance" without even noticing.
  • Max Last
    Max Last
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Nov 2011 Posts: 3,254
    bruce_lee said:
    Taking out turrets faster also increases survivability by keeping you stopped less. Trading one special out is not a problem and will not have much impact. Mortars are not the only thing our bases have to guard against.
    Blitzers don't stop anyway, missile ships take out turrets in half the time of mortars even without this, and mortars already take out turrets in a volley or two if you neutralize anti-mortar. So you spend a special to insure it's a single volley.  you've saved 50% of the time sitting at the turret at the cost of either, more weaponry, more armor (DNX only), a special that might reduce the time taken killing the guard a half inch further down from the turret, or a defensive special that might reduce the direct fire damage that moving that half inch further didn't really help much with.
    Back to my exact same spot:  Tower west, sector 7. coords 3631,461
  • dggGrayGhost
    dggGrayGhost
    Greenhorn
    Joined Jun 2012 Posts: 17
    Well before we throw the baby out with the bath water we should just chillax, and know that most likely the next raid will have a counter measure to even things up.  It would just be sort of nice to have a raid every sixty days so there's actually some time to make fleets.  Dropping the tier 3 amount in mini raids to something indicative of their value, not just to get people's money would also be a step in the right direction, especially for lower level players so they can have the tools needed.  It takes a long time to get to the point where you can get to the top prize levels in a raid without help.  Kixeye, maybe it's time to reflect on your corporate motto that you have carved in your offices and ask yourself are we still adhering to what we started believing when we started this company?
  • Zorkinator
    Zorkinator
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Feb 2013 Posts: 210
    I guess this is part of their commitment to the low/middle tier folks that have no way to get the high end hulls. The high levels can already level most bases, this will just ensure it. What it may do though is allow mid tier players to have a shot at using mid-tier hulls to hit higher level bases.

    Maybe.

    I don't like the change - I would have rather seen them release that earlier version of Counter Measures that added combat resistances to all fleets. But I am guessing that will be coming the next raid. Again - the game is obviously geared to high end players, and the mid-tiers will always have to wait on things like the last hull raid to have a shot at getting some kind of decent base hitting hull. The Mauler is just a glorified HH - and while it is better than an HH, it is only marginally better than say a Mercury hull. The Mauler would have made more sense as a 39% mortar hull, rather than the mish-mash mortar/missile hull we got.

    It is getting old to see the cycle of escalation progressing.
  • vetehinen
    vetehinen
    Master Tactician
    Joined Dec 2011 Posts: 2,232
    Max Last said:
    vetehinen said:
    Heavy fleet 

    2 ships 2 DNX 8 siege B mortar + special = 44 800 damage per salvo with splash of 30 its every thing down 2 land tiles away from hit point 

    You hit base guard in channel only 2 water block wide it will blow all out from inner island too  ... there is videos of this on you tube wiith no + 75 % damage bonus !

    2 ships 2 tritons 8 siege B mortars + special = 64 000 damage from one salvo ... what has that much armor points in base ? 


    We knew this a year ago when DNX first ruled the seas.  If you've forgotten this and designed bases with this vulnerability in the meantime I simply have no words to describe your complaint.

    As for your last question, I think it's a very good one.  Why would you be so stupid as to build a fleet wasting 50% of it's firepower, especially one that can be completely shut down by a single bombard and 4 Hail C.  Ignoring the fact that it would then time out trying to kill a single explosive resistance Goliath or Thresher.

    ETA:  It really isn't so much the 'OMG SKY IS FALLING LOLJK ITS MORTARDAMURUNG' that really irritates me, it's the outright stupidity of some of the examples you people are using.

    More Damage to the cerbs ?.... They are gone in one volly lol What if i take hull streamline off my DNX Magic am i losing anything then ?.... No i lose nothing and gain 75% building damage so tell me how am i lowering my fleet survivability ?.....
    Replacing hull streamline with siege equipment, eh?  Lost nothing, eh?  So, what orifice did you pull the extra 17% weapon weight from?
    I did not put all on that quote ... also not seen many DNX fleet lately usually to last attack ppl seem to use MCX .

    ... last train left already i cant see any points from latest things put in here they all go over the top with 75 % bonus on this and that 

    Just like one war game that goes offline in this month ... they put more range to some defense , new troops , new items to shop , finally working full screen on all browsers , list goes on and then they put out we will end this game in 3 weeks ! 
  • Max Last
    Max Last
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Nov 2011 Posts: 3,254
    edited 21 Aug 2013, 8:31PM
    Ultros said:
    Let me put Sarap's argument about the mort fleets with Siege Special losing defense properties to rest for good:

    1. My base has NEVER been taken by a DN X fleet, and quite many enemies have tried. Today this changed.
    2. An enemy attacked me with a 3 DN X fleet with 4 Siege Mort B on each ship.
    3. To build such a fleet, you have to sacrifice defensive capabilities.
    4. The fleet killed my turrets in seconds, and the splash finished off almost all nearby def ships as well (and my def fleet has high expl defense).
    5. This was "just" Siege B, obviously WITHOUT the Siege Targetting special.

    CONCLUSION: Siege Mort B/Shockwave Q and Siege Targetting special overcome ANY KIND of base defense. They kill turrets so fast that long-range turrets barely have a chance to hit them. Def fleet gets killed via splash and hardly necessitates additional stops. Attacking fleets running such a set-up can forego defensive boni because they simply kill bases so quickly they hardly get hit. THIS IS A DEFINITIVE UNBALANCE.

    SOLUTION: The immediate release of the improved Draconian Bombard. Lower the damage value of Siege Targetting, or bin the whole idea for the time being. Siege Mort B and Shockwave Q should carry weight penalties.
    image

    Solution: Fix your **** base.

    ETA:  Yes they were siege B and Shock Q fleets, no you have no reason to believe that even if I re-edited it to put the timestamps back.  At least one person here can vouch for one of the fleets if they want.
    Back to my exact same spot:  Tower west, sector 7. coords 3631,461
  • wesker
    wesker
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Sep 2011 Posts: 5,473
    hell i can take out my engine 3 thruster 3 and put speed system 3 and have lvl 3 new special and it wouldent make a diffrent on how i control and use my fleet instead will kill bases a lot easer lmfao special over powered i wonder how new seige mortar B will do lol

    Decimate the Weak

    Ships Won: who cares you will see them :D 
    BP-ID: 1824740....lvl 72

  • johnboy83
    johnboy83
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Jan 2012 Posts: 131
    Personally I feel the game is, and has been out of balance forever. As a non-spender I LOVE THIS!!! I can refit my DNXs with siege b and ST-3 and be able to kill guys who have dumped 20 grand in there game just as easily as they can kill me. HAHAHAHA. Nicely done Kix, nicely done ;)
  • Zorkinator
    Zorkinator
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Feb 2013 Posts: 210
    ...And here is the question. What is it Kixeye is trying to Fix? All this seems to be doing is adding MORE problems, and MORE imbalance to the game. Someone needs to slow the flywheel down - this change with the siege targeting is going to make things like thresher fleets super godly as well. What is the point of level 5 walls, when you quickly release weapons that completely over power level 5 walls? I mean I have a good idea on the answer - and the smart people will know and understand this as well. Threshers will blow through level 5 walls like paper, MCX will kill turrets so fast they will barely have to stop, and dnx - well dnx will just flatten them even faster assuming they can 1) get to T3 on the minis, and 2) get the luck of the draw to get a new mortar.

    Fix things and you will make players a lot happier. It seems if you keep down this road of mega escalation you are going to end up with a small core of players that will coin til they're bankrupt, and a bunch of new folks too early in the process to know any better. 


  • beel78
    beel78
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Apr 2012 Posts: 8,187
    Lise said:
    Furthermore, the base guarding fleet hasn't really been taken into consideration in these viewpoints (even if you don't include the Guardian); so yes, you'll do more damage to buildings and turrets, but you'll still be getting hit by the base guarding fleet - Siege Targeting has no beneficial effect to these ships.
    Okay let's talk about that.  The usual logic of base defense is to force an attacker to stop at the Cerbs so that the long range weapons in the center island and the ship weapons have more time to do their work.  This is especially true of players who rely heavily on researchable technologies.  You point out that ships aren't affected as if that were news.  Some of us have already crunched the numbers based on DPS of various offensive builds, the resistances and hit points of our platforms, and the DPS of our long range weapons and defensive ships.  

    Siege Targeting does affect the defensive fleet, just not as directly.  Let's say a player uses ship based mortars on defense and for simplicity's sake we'll say they do that with hulls and mortars that are already available, leaving out the Guardian and the new mortar.  When the Cerbs die faster that defensive fleet becomes proportionately less effective.  That effect is inevitable.  And it's going to take a lot of refitting for a player who runs that type of defense to even partially compensate for that setback.

    So either there are undisclosed stats on these new specials or else the Kixeye team is underestimating how much the players are taking into consideration.  Would you have a look at Schmee's update, perhaps?  
    Sure, could you provide me the link? Also, on the topic of the defense fleet scenario; I'm not sure what ships you're using or what the loadouts are, but while the Cerbs may take more damage, fleets will have a lower survivability if you've swapped Siege Targeting in place of another utility special - losing any additional damage protection or evade they may have had.
    More Damage to the cerbs ?.... They are gone in one volly lol What if i take hull streamline off my DNX Magic am i losing anything then ?.... No i lose nothing and gain 75% building damage so tell me how am i lowering my fleet survivability ?.....
    well hull streamline weighs nothing..this is 14% increase on all weapons.... so if you were close to maxed out (assumed since you used hull streamline as a 'filler' special) then what makes you think this will super enhance your attack capabilities?  Its all about give and take.  If you think getting through the turrets one less salvo quicker ( new morts it only takes one salvo anyway) will make you beat the guard any faster then...well good luck to you.  Even all shocks you can only have 30 of the new shocks with it if you are using HE3 as well.  So they will kill a turret in one salvo.....just like they did when you had 45 of them but now you have less to kill the guards with.
  • Jewels1908
    Jewels1908
    Greenhorn
    Joined Jul 2013 Posts: 1
    I think what they are trying to do is level the playing field for lower level players. Im a level 44 and I cant ever get into any bases higher than 50 but I get crushed by 60's and up. With this new thing I will have a fighting chance in these higher bases.
  • LSU-WAR
    LSU-WAR
    Greenhorn
    Joined Apr 2012 Posts: 17
    hmmmm so your saying you want unbeatable bases? get over it really anybase can be broken and will be broken it doesnt matter the guns if i coined. i could break any base. i break most bases i hit without coining so if i did coin i would get in anybase and this is using DNx with shock L's nothing really special cause most people have DNx now
  • Max Last
    Max Last
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Nov 2011 Posts: 3,254
    cyo2 said:
    add this to new medal program & all bases under lv 60 will be in constant bubble. When that happens I leave the game
    Pretty sure they said that about every change ever made.  As a side note, if a nub base is worth 1 medal on a win and a loss of 50 if you lose, I might just take the time to look for someone more competent. 
    Back to my exact same spot:  Tower west, sector 7. coords 3631,461
  • sickinger_immortal
    sickinger_immortal
    Forsaken Champion
    Joined Jul 2011 Posts: 477
    I have to agree with liam on this one.  make a fleet in ultimate shipyard, use cluster 2, adds the same weapon weight, then do the total fleet damage X.75 and add that to the fleet damage.  i threw together a quick, and very balli/halo resistant triton fleet putting out over 50k damage per volley with shock L, and i have shock Q so it would prolly be more over 60k...  that will 1 shot everything in your base.  even the splash damage should kill everything in 1 volley.  its to much.  if you have op near anything 1 or 2 shots of splash and its dead  this will force people to keep op away from everything more then they already do and bases will become 100% reliant on base guards.  so anyone who hasnt been here or hasnt coined good guards is screwed by any nub with a fleet that has even 60% resist.
    Guns don't kill people, I DO!!!
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