Damage Protection Rule Changes

  • Fros-t
    Fros-t
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Mar 2012 Posts: 349
    This sounds great.Still need to do something different with the fleet attacks popping bubbles.Though its understandable when you go aout to attack and you have 10 fleets of bubbled people trying their hardest to get at your fleets.
    Fros-t
  • Fire_DS
    Fire_DS
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Dec 2011 Posts: 933
    humor me on this idea to go along with the damage protection feature. as it is now DEAD DOCK= NO PLAY for 4 hours while repairing (if no coin is used), why not still allow players to launch fleets to salvages/rank up even if the dock is dead...but not be able to attack players/bases until it's repaired. This will solve the "rocket dock" issue so it can be used as a strategy instead of a bullying tactic. Also, this would progress to solving one of the problems that people are crying about needing damage protection/buddy bubbles.
    image
  • Roland Bullock
    Roland Bullock
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Nov 2011 Posts: 931
    Terry Wolf wrote: »
    If he hits my captured salv, and my fleet is there, I WILL HAVE INITIATED IT. Learn how the game works before you **** about what I wrote.

    Dont click "Attack Fleet" on anyones fleet, simple.
    Desert_Warfare
    Level 67 Originated in 142
    Currently in 191
  • blksvt
    blksvt
    Potential Threat
    Joined May 2011 Posts: 77
    NOTE: Make sure you've read the rules for posting in this forum: http://forums.kixeye.com/showthread.php?t=185189 . Also be sure to read this post in it's entirety before you reply. Any posts that do not comply with the forum rules, will be promptly removed.

    Greeting Captains, we’ve received substantial feedback from the Community that the current Damage Protection rules foster an environment that encourages “Buddy Bubbling.” We gone back to the drawing table and developed a new Damage Protection System that we hope balances the game for everyone. Read the details below and we look forward to reading your thoughts.

    Why change the Damage Protection rules?
    With the current set of rules, players are able to indefinitely hide behind the damage protection bubble by using the “Buddy Bubble” exploit. Obviously, this is not the desired game experience, and a tweak to the rules can prevent it.

    Proposed New Damage Protection Rules
    Under the new system, there will be four different instances (two different situations) in which a player’s base would receive Damage Protection:
    • When a base has suffered 25% - 49% damage at the end of an attack, the base will receive 12 hours of Damage Protection.
    • When a base has suffered 50% - 74% damage at the end of an attack, the base will receive 24 hours of Damage Protection.
    • When a base has suffered 75% - 100% damage at the end of an attack, the base will receive 36 hours of Damage Protection.
    • When a base has been attacked 8 times in four hours (but suffered less than 25% damage), the base will receive 1 hour of Damage Protection.
    For the last rule of Damage Protection, we feel it’s still necessary to allow players the one-hour of protection for those that are repeatedly getting their docks hit with rockets and/or snipers (SFB3). Also, if you attack another player’s fleets or base, the number of attacks made against you within the past four hours will be reset to zero and remove the bubble from your base (if already under Damage Protection).

    Q: I need to buddy bubble so I can build/upgrade my buildings; how will I make any progress?
    A: There’s no challenge in a game where players are immune to penalties. Suffering delays to build times is part of the game; however, there are things that you can do such as relocating to a sector that does not have as much base hitting, or join an alliance where other players will take you under their wing.

    Q: Will you be changing how long it takes for certain buildings to repair like the Dock or the Launchpad?
    A: Currently there are no plans to change the repair times for any buildings; however, after the new Damage Protection System goes live, we will closely monitor the situation and see if any changes need to be made.

    Q: My Dock is going to get pummeled all the time; how will I be able to launch my fleets?
    A: If players are plotting against you, recruit some allies or join an existing group. Players will be much less likely to continuously attack your dock if they know that your allies will retaliate against them. There’s strength in numbers.

    the only problem i see is the 4th rule. if you think about it it gives a player 6 tries to kill the patrol fleet i hit to prep then the final hit. that is to many times. cause the blitz fleets people are using now are really hard to stop but this makes it worse.
    Blksvt-SBS Level 55
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  • Country Sniper
    Country Sniper
    Potential Threat
    Joined May 2012 Posts: 83
    hey swag this going to happen before or after the new level structure change?

    IGN : Country Sniper 

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  • Roland Bullock
    Roland Bullock
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Nov 2011 Posts: 931
    BTW, Love the, hit a fleet andlose your bubble idea! You want to engage in battle with another you gotta pay the consequences!
    Desert_Warfare
    Level 67 Originated in 142
    Currently in 191
  • Alan 'Aqua Mole' Hailes
    Alan 'Aqua Mole' Hailes
    Potential Threat
    Joined Jul 2010 Posts: 35
    drwall16 wrote: »

    Of all the changes I think that the one hour bubble is needed to help a player when under the circumstances that you mentioned. However is it possible that if a players dock is hit that they then get a bubble that at least covers the duration of their dock repair? In many instances, especially for those that are higher levels a 1 hr bubble is not going to cover the amount of time it takes to repair their dock.

    I also don't think that attacking a fleet should remove a person’s bubble. There are many instances where a person will go help a friend who is under attack but are still waiting for their base to repair. If a fleet attack takes away a person’s bubble then this person is extremely vulnerable.

    Other than those few suggestions I think that these changes are going add a great deal of much need and long over due improvement to what is alreay a great game.

    +1 and if there were a bubble just for dock repair duration it would be pointless to use it for buddy bubbles as that person then wouldnt be able to launch fleets.
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  • Legaleagle266
    Legaleagle266
    Greenhorn
    Joined Mar 2012 Posts: 16
    There is one major problem with the damage protection change. What if players wishes to redo their base layout, you can't redesign a base layout while it's under repair. Or have players redo their base without any kind of protection and end up being hit while redesigning their layout. Therefore you have to offer players a way to redesign their bases by having some form of protection without having to take damage in order to be bubble protected.
  • Pamela
    Pamela
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Jun 2011 Posts: 638
    [/LIST]Also, if you attack another player’s fleets or base, the number of attacks made against you within the past four hours will be reset to zero and remove the bubble from your base (if already under Damage Protection).

    Just looking for some clarification here... I read this to mean that IF you are under a # of attacks bubble you will lose your bubble NOT if you are still over a certain amount damaged.

    Is this correct ? For example, if someone mashes my base ... and I still want to play for the 6 hours that it takes my guns to repair (realistically the 4 it takes for them to be good enough because I've gotten bored and want to go out and hit another base) am I still able to FvF at that point? Or am I restricted from playing the game at all until my bubble is ready to drop?

    (please understand people, I'm not talking about no damage 8 hit bubbles, I'm talking about after my base has been broken)
  • LORDCLAW 1982
    LORDCLAW 1982
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined May 2012 Posts: 331
    Ilike the whole idea only flaw i see if the dock getting bunker busted maybe you should limit how much damage a bb is allowd to do to a dock rather than the full 4 hrs this would be better for some player who play solo they are in alot of trouble if someone bbs there dock every hr on the hr
    LVL 68  PART OF THE BTTB ALLIANCE WINNER OF ALL HULLS TO DATE IM A BAD PIRATE :)
  • tingstromjon
    tingstromjon
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Sep 2011 Posts: 111
    Dont click "Attack Fleet" on anyones fleet, simple.

    If you hit a captured salv. and the guy who captured it has a fleet sitting there, that fleet will AUTO_ATTACK you. It will, in other words, INITIATE the attack to protect the salv. No one has to click "attack any **** thing." So I hit a salv. My SWs are sitting there, waiting for the FF fleet to come by and load the salv., and some salv. thief comes by and clicks "attack cargo" my SWs will attack him even if I'm in the can and no where near the PC....they will INITIATE the attack in other words...am I the only person who knows this?

    Bottom Line: Bubbles having ANYTHING to do with FvF or vis-versa is a HORRIBLE IDEA.



  • Jay Anderson
    Jay Anderson
    Greenhorn
    Joined May 2012 Posts: 1
    So if you get bubbled and you go to protect your sector. If I hit the attacking fleet I lose my bubble? So instead of doing that - I'll not do anything and wait till my base repairs and I lost my bubble in a timed fashion?

    That is sure going to help game play......... NOT
  • Roland Bullock
    Roland Bullock
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Nov 2011 Posts: 931
    Terry Wolf wrote: »
    If you hit a captured salv. and the guy who captured it has a fleet sitting there, that fleet will AUTO_ATTACK you. It will, in other words, INITIATE the attack to protect the salv. No one has to click "attack any **** thing." So I hit a salv. My SWs are sitting there, waiting for the FF fleet to come by and load the salv., and some salv. thief comes by and clicks "attack cargo" my SWs will attack him even if I'm in the can and no where near the PC....they will INITIATE the attack in other words...am I the only person who knows this?

    Thats computer generated initiation, if you lose your bubble cuz your sitting on a salvage and someone comes to attack you to gain that salvage then I agree that isnt right.
    Desert_Warfare
    Level 67 Originated in 142
    Currently in 191
  • ColdSavage-CF
    ColdSavage-CF
    Potential Threat
    Joined Feb 2012 Posts: 74
    WOW Kixeye Really you guys deleted my post because I didn't agree with you all. I didn't spam, curse or disrespected anyone and followed your Forums rules, still thank god that there's cut and paste:


    I don't care about bubbles no bubbles or what ever...what I'm amazed is that you guys actually think that removing the protection on a base if you engage Fleet to Fleet is balancing the game play. WHAT!! are you guys thinking, do you all sit around getting drunk and smoking pot all day to come up with this kind of stuff? Or are you allowing the same guy that redesigned the ships and screwed them all up still come up with these ideas for Kixeye? I'm a repair and at times fleet coiner (I can afford it) and I think this is unfair to those that don't coin, get rid of the buddy bubbling crap but to penalize another player for trying to stop an attack is ridiculous and flat out wrong. We love seeing the smaller players (which are the one's usually bubbled) help other fight off attacks because they can't hit the bases, sounds to me that what your creating here is a game that's more for coiners like myself, and I see this as a bad idea on your part because your taking away to much from your smaller player, the one's that will become future coiners :) when they're able to build the nicer toys. Come now you guys really really should reevaluate this kind of garbage. Also has Kixeye ever heard of listening to your customers? I have counted the post about people being against more than those wanting it and still you guys go forward with it. Give your players what they want.
  • InGloRiouS_BasTrd
    InGloRiouS_BasTrd
    Potential Threat
    Joined Nov 2011 Posts: 46
    Well...I guess a year at the helm is enough...especially now that flt battles pops DP...and Glitcheye is still Glitcheye...I guess it's time to stop playing. Since Kixeye doesn't want to listen to it's customers there is no point being one anymore. Bye
  • Roland Bullock
    Roland Bullock
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Nov 2011 Posts: 931
    So if you get bubbled and you go to protect your sector. If I hit the attacking fleet I lose my bubble? So instead of doing that - I'll not do anything and wait till my base repairs and I lost my bubble in a timed fashion?

    That is sure going to help game play......... NOT

    More people without bubbles mean more bases to hit, MORE gameplay! Love it!
    Desert_Warfare
    Level 67 Originated in 142
    Currently in 191
  • kris1019
    kris1019
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Sep 2011 Posts: 3,475
    Hold shift and you can move building that is repairing or upgrading.
    Stryke wrote: »
    There is one major problem with the damage protection change. What if players wishes to redo their base layout, you can't redesign a base layout while it's under repair. Or have players redo their base without any kind of protection and end up being hit while redesigning their layout. Therefore you have to offer players a way to redesign their bases by having some form of protection without having to take damage in order to be bubble protected.
  • Gainn
    Gainn
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Aug 2010 Posts: 867
    Terry Wolf wrote: »
    If he hits my captured salv, and my fleet is there, I WILL HAVE INITIATED IT. Learn how the game works before you **** about what I wrote.

    Swag, can we have a definitive answer to this please?

    These changes seem a little drastic in the bubble times given as it will leave many more people open to follow up attacks before they have a chance to fully repair.

    The FvF bubble popper will stop smaller players from getting involved in FvF and learning the game/wanting to get better/ spending more.
    They could however just move into a battle area, park and wait to be hit if they really want some FvF action, therefore keeping the bubble... but then they will just get creamed by bigger players so that wont last long.

    Just drop the 10 hit / 2 day bubble and frubbles will be a thing of the past.

    Oh, and add a 4 level flak weapon slot to the dock that has a 10, 15, 20 or 25% chance of knocking a rocket out within its range while you're at it.. ;)
    Winner - EVERYTHING!
    sheranraj wrote: »
    if i get banned I am gonna quit playing this game..
  • kris1019
    kris1019
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Sep 2011 Posts: 3,475
    It says "remove bubble from base if under damage protection" so yes you will lose your bubble for attacking a fleet.
    Pam DeLine wrote: »
    Just looking for some clarification here... I read this to mean that IF you are under a # of attacks bubble you will lose your bubble NOT if you are still over a certain amount damaged.

    Is this correct ? For example, if someone mashes my base ... and I still want to play for the 6 hours that it takes my guns to repair (realistically the 4 it takes for them to be good enough because I've gotten bored and want to go out and hit another base) am I still able to FvF at that point? Or am I restricted from playing the game at all until my bubble is ready to drop?

    (please understand people, I'm not talking about no damage 8 hit bubbles, I'm talking about after my base has been broken)
  • Pamela
    Pamela
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Jun 2011 Posts: 638
    kris1019 wrote: »
    It says "remove bubble from base if under damage protection" so yes you will lose your bubble for attacking a fleet.

    Yes, and at the beginning of that paragraph it says "For the last rule of damage protection"

    Which is why I'm looking for clarification from Kixeye.
  • kris1019
    kris1019
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Sep 2011 Posts: 3,475
    Anyone with any time-length of bubble would be popped if you initiate combat against a rival player fleet or base.

    Its on page 6 of this post if your interested.

    Pam DeLine wrote: »
    Yes, and at the beginning of that paragraph it says "For the last rule of damage protection"

    Which is why I'm looking for clarification from Kixeye.
  • Michael Peltier
    Michael Peltier
    Greenhorn
    Joined May 2012 Posts: 13
    I believe 25% needs to stay at 25% changing this would cause huge problems for players getting hit by players on the top of their lvl bracket. A 35 hitting a 30 will no longer have a chance once a prep is performed.
  • Pamela
    Pamela
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Jun 2011 Posts: 638
    kris1019 wrote: »
    Its on page 6 of this post if your interested.

    LOL thanks, somehow I missed that when I was scrolling through.

    I do think it could be implemented that if you are still over 25% damaged or whatever you can still FvF and just not hit bases but ....

    Think about it, someone mashes my base, I now can't go hit bases unless I want to leave my base wide open. But I'm bored... so what do I do? I coin my dock and find someone who wants to fleet battle to kill time while I'm waiting... Kix, you're gonna lose alot of income because of that. I would say, if your bubble was got through multiple hits then yes, it should drop. If you are all healed (say base it on gun repair time only since the LP takes forever and doesn't need to be healed to protect a base) then yes the bubble drops. If you are damaged and hit a base, yes the bubble drops.

    BUT if you are damaged and go out for FvF fun .... you should still be given the repair time. This is essentially punishing the full time players for the actions of the **** Bubblers..

    On that note ... Yay for no more **** Bubblers :D
  • bob_on_me
    bob_on_me
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Jan 2012 Posts: 849
    If I'm reading this Right If you are under a bubble and you hit a fleet your bubble with pop..I hope that's not the case ..my turret's take 6 hour's to repair ,and I still like to help my friends .

    .. bp name Bob_on_me.
  • Epicness_Ninjaa
    Epicness_Ninjaa
    Potential Threat
    Joined Aug 2012 Posts: 47
    Does This Mean You Lose You Bubble If Someone Hits Your Fleet?
  • Roland Bullock
    Roland Bullock
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Nov 2011 Posts: 931
    Does This Mean You Lose You Bubble If Someone Hits Your Fleet?

    It says if you initiate the battle with the other player
    Desert_Warfare
    Level 67 Originated in 142
    Currently in 191
  • ManBearPig
    ManBearPig
    Potential Threat
    Joined Jul 2011 Posts: 29
    Kixeye, I love you for this. Thank you!!!!
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  • A3Sapper
    A3Sapper
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Dec 2011 Posts: 332
    Proposed New Damage Protection Rules
    Under the new system, there will be four different instances (two different situations) in which a player’s base would receive Damage Protection:
    • When a base has suffered 25% - 49% damage at the end of an attack, the base will receive 12 hours of Damage Protection.
    • When a base has been attacked 8 times in four hours (but suffered less than 25% damage), the base will receive 1 hour of Damage Protection.
    For the last rule of Damage Protection, we feel it’s still necessary to allow players the one-hour of protection for those that are repeatedly getting their docks hit with rockets and/or snipers (SFB3). Also, if you attack another player’s fleets or base, the number of attacks made against you within the past four hours will be reset to zero and remove the bubble from your base (if already under Damage Protection).

    Q: I need to buddy bubble so I can build/upgrade my buildings; how will I make any progress?
    A: There’s no challenge in a game where players are immune to penalties. Suffering delays to build times is part of the game; however, there are things that you can do such as relocating to a sector that does not have as much base hitting, or join an alliance where other players will take you under their wing.

    Q: Will you be changing how long it takes for certain buildings to repair like the Dock or the Launchpad?
    A: Currently there are no plans to change the repair times for any buildings; however, after the new Damage Protection System goes live, we will closely monitor the situation and see if any changes need to be made.

    Q: My Dock is going to get pummeled all the time; how will I be able to launch my fleets?
    A: If players are plotting against you, recruit some allies or join an existing group. Players will be much less likely to continuously attack your dock if they know that your allies will retaliate against them. There’s strength in numbers.

    Kixeye CMs,
    I am all for this change. Infact, I am sure this will be the greatest thing update wise, that has been or will be released ever.
    But, I personally think a few changes should be made. I have read all of the comments below. A lot are good. Time for it to be consolidated.
    Lets start at the top and work our way down..

    The 25%-49% for 12 hours is unrealistic. I work. I sleep. When I get home, I find my base was attacked shortly after leaving for work. Meaning that roughly 8-9 hours have gone by. Leaving me 3-4 hours of bubble remaining. 18 Hours should be the time here. Leave it be please.
    The 8 attacks for a hour bub. Great!! No more frubbles.

    Attacking a fleet while bubbled. Good and bad at the same time. Good because the people who rock frubbles are a nuisance to players who actually fight. So by them loosing there bubble, I can then go flatten them for being a nuisance. Bad, because now you cant defend someone if you are still repairing. Contrary to popular belief, few people coin there defenses. Choosing to coin fleet repairs. You might (i say might because i have no evidence) loose some money this way. But over all, I like this.

    As has been mentioned, SFB3 fleets are no problem. If you are being sniped by SFB3 fleets, then either change your base, or deal with it.
    Now rocket attacks are getting annoying. Rockets should not be allowed to hit a dock at all. Period. In a real base attack, what purpose does the dock do? NOTHING. With that said, rockets should not be allowed to hit a dock. NOW if you are going to insist on keeping it, might consider one of several advice's offered here.
    Option 1 - Reduce dock repair time to less than 5 mins. Dock will also start a Auto repair if attacked.
    Option 2 - Dock begins auto repair. This is for if you keep dock repair times the same. This way, if you are attacked and 100% damaged(or close) and you get on and only have 2 hours to repair your towers, you will still be able to at least launch a patrol fleet to defend until the towers finish. Something to consider if you are hell bent on 12h for 25% damage.
    Option 3 - Rockets have a percentage chance to hit the dock. 25% should suffice. This option has multiple benefits for both the players and you. One, a rocket misses, chances are they might coin another. If so, you win. Its a win win for everyone but the poor excuse of a person who is being low and cant actually do anything to your base.
    Option 4 - Remove the ability to rocket docks. Meaning docks can only be damaged by SHIP based weaponry. Pinch, or ANY rocket can not damage the dock or cause any issues what so ever. Problem solved for the guys who LIKE to play and only coin fleet repairs.

    As for the Launch pad, The repair times are already out of control. In retrospect, it should be less time than the dock. As a dock handles the transactions and comings and goings of ships(the purpose of the game) Where as the pad, is just a concrete block with a few metal supports. If you change it to 2 hours, but have it so you loose the rocket that is on the pad. Then chances are you will win again. As players will have to either wait for rocket to build to use or COIN it. Chances are coining will be the answer.

    Repair times and Research.
    If you are going to change the DP rules then this rule MUST be changed. I understand you want to make money. But, how will you keep a player playing long enough if they cant get up the stuff to actually play. Chances are you might find that if they managed to get up to lvl30(current system) with halfway decent stuff, then they may coin some. Albeit a little. But every penny counts. Dont it?
    Right now as it stands, if a building upgrade or research in a building, is destroyed, then 8 hours will be tacked on. PLUS the repair time of said building. Not to mention the time it will take for you to log in. If you make the changes above with out considering this, then players will never be able to have the stuff to even place in there base or on there fleets. Meaning no since even playing. Most will stop when getting to lvl 20+. So new player retention? None existent. You will have some to go on to end game, but chances are they will stop because its too "hard" to get anywhere when you are rimmed by people who cant actually hit you. With that being said, Research/upgrades should be Paused till the building is repaired. No time should be added to research or upgrades. I had a upgrade that was less than 10m from completion. Got hit. Said building was killed. Hit again(first hit prep), now ofcourse I hit repair, so said building killed again. 16 hours was added to that upgrade. Completely Stupid if you ask me.

    My suggestions and ideas are my own and those of the posters above. They also represent MOST players that are active and play the game as intended. They are generally your minor to Medium coiners. Your bread and butter. Heavy coiners dont really count lol as they coin everything to begin with. (Disclaimer I am not knocking coiners. I coin. Just not as much as others)
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  • KarateGarate
    KarateGarate
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Mar 2012 Posts: 241
    Overall, excellent ideas. I am a huge advocate of getting rid of buddy bubbling. That being said, I have a couple of concerns:

    1: Bubble times: the current times for bubbles based on damage I think are ok. 12 hours is too little time for 49% damage, especially considering the repair times on some of the top tier patrol fleets and normal sleep cycles for people (someone getting hit right after going to bed would be screwed). I think that a better tier might be:

    25-29% - 6 hours
    30-39% - 12 hours
    40-49% - 18 hours
    50-59% - 24 hours
    60-69% - 30 hours
    70-79% - 36 hours
    80-89% - 42 hours
    90-100% - 48 hours

    2: My second concern is with new system and what it means for dock sniping. It's been raised several times before in this thread, but I really feel you need to look more closely at this BEFORE release. Losing your dock is already a sure fire way of ensuring that you aren't playing the game. Add in the ability to do this more and you could effectively have players that are kept from playing indefinitely. Telling them to find friends isn't an answer. I do not think this game should rely solely on group vs group combat and lone wolves should be able to enjoy the game as well as any others. I know you addressed that dock repair times were not being looked at, but I really think you should especially if this update comes to fruition. Reducing dock repairs to be no more than an hour would keep people playing more. Another good idea that has been brought up is to make the dock untargettable by rockets or give it an inherent 90% explosive/rocket resistance.

    Overall though, great initial idea, I just hope you build on it and make it better.
    KarateGarate
    Level 34
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  • Barnacle Bob
    Barnacle Bob
    Potential Threat
    Joined Feb 2012 Posts: 29
    For the last rule of Damage Protection, we feel it’s still necessary to allow players the one-hour of protection for those that are repeatedly getting their docks hit with rockets and/or snipers (SFB3). Also, if you attack another player’s fleets or base, the number of attacks made against you within the past four hours will be reset to zero and remove the bubble from your base (if already under Damage Protection).

    So what youre saying is that when an alliance swarms into your sector with 20+ people and they hit the entire sector base to base. if your base has been hit you cant defend your neighbors without opening up a defenseless base to another attack from a player usually 3 levels higher? Dont know what sector you guys play in but that kills any chance of sector camaradie and FORCES players into alliances. Yeah Kixeye, I want to join a group of bullies. That's always the answer, team up with the bullies.

    Kixeye, you took our ability to launch pinches to defend our bases, why dont you remove the ability to launch rockets on a base attack until 25% damage(meaning they arent just targetting the dock, or take rockets out of base attacks.

    if you lose your dock to sfb3 equipped fleets, thats your fault
This discussion has been closed.