Official Decimation discussion thread

  • karthik Gopalan
    karthik Gopalan
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Feb 2015 Posts: 466

    @CM_Lee said:
    SEAL Corps1 said:

    Are the L110 Vanguards supposed to drop M6 Cavalier fragments or its supposed to be Bastion? 

    Double checked the event list and this is correct, the fragment drop is for Cutters. Looks like the pattern around all 110's is the box drop is different from the fragments to spread it around. 

    If decimation is latest tech why aren't they altarian refit tokens? Or blank, could you please answer that? Also void /plasma armor? CW is coming...

    Oh my goodness! You just aren't going to quit on the refit tokens are you ? despite the number of times I myself have explained to you as to why. Either go farm if you are a free player or buy coins. I mean just stop flooding every thread with some random stuff. It's getting cluttered and unreadable. 
  • LilBasterd
    LilBasterd
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Mar 2018 Posts: 458

    You can't farm refit tokens [ ya ya riots here is that issue...] I use to but kixeye did what they do and cut the rewards in half but left the points needed the same.. not cool at all and makes no sense...

    It's pretty easy to read what I type, I do try. Just looking for an answer as what they say seldom matches what they do.

    Why be against a fellow player trying to push for a more rewarding game?

    And i do try to stick to only a few topics I feel would make great changes for players of all levels.

    Lastly as said before no one is forcing you to read or reply to me so why do it? You can block me at anytime why you and others chose not to , well that's a interesting question.

  • karthik Gopalan
    karthik Gopalan
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Feb 2015 Posts: 466

    You can't farm refit tokens [ ya ya riots here is that issue...] I use to but kixeye did what they do and cut the rewards in half but left the points needed the same.. not cool at all and makes no sense...

    It's pretty easy to read what I type, I do try. Just looking for an answer as what they say seldom matches what they do.

    Why be against a fellow player trying to push for a more rewarding game?

    And i do try to stick to only a few topics I feel would make great changes for players of all levels.

    Lastly as said before no one is forcing you to read or reply to me so why do it? You can block me at anytime why you and others chose not to , well that's a interesting question.

    Kix cut the rewards because 4 days of refits/builds was too much. Which in high sight, I agree with. I can get an operational Bastion out in 8 days. If I plan it such that I get two riots done in 8 days, I will literally have the ship done for free. See the issue ? 16 days of refits/builds in a month is ridiculous. That is 3840 coins in a month. Seems like a major revenue channel lost. I have explained this too. Suggest you spend some time reading and understanding business models. 

    I am not talking about coherence from an English language or subject perspective. That is fine. Even Google translate or will spew out correct spellings. That isn't the point. Most of what you say is nothing but conspiracy theories at best. And you are just there EVERYWHERE. If there's garbage everywhere you just can't ignore it can you. 

    Said it before, will say it again, back up your data with facts, not conspiracy theories. You actually do bring up a valid point at times. But they get lost in all the conspiracy theories you keep putting up. I have been here and hence I speak for myself. Kix's business model is that of catering to the P2W model. Upto us to see if you like it or not. If you don't just quit. Are you sure you need so much negativity in your life? It obviously causes so much grief to you. Why play? 
  • Daniel Rose
    Daniel Rose
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Jul 2016 Posts: 592

    You can't farm refit tokens [ ya ya riots here is that issue...] I use to but kixeye did what they do and cut the rewards in half but left the points needed the same.. not cool at all and makes no sense...

    It's pretty easy to read what I type, I do try. Just looking for an answer as what they say seldom matches what they do.

    Why be against a fellow player trying to push for a more rewarding game?

    And i do try to stick to only a few topics I feel would make great changes for players of all levels.

    Lastly as said before no one is forcing you to read or reply to me so why do it? You can block me at anytime why you and others chose not to , well that's a interesting question.

    Kix cut the rewards because 4 days of refits/builds was too much. Which in high sight, I agree with. I can get an operational Bastion out in 8 days. If I plan it such that I get two riots done in 8 days, I will literally have the ship done for free. See the issue ? 16 days of refits/builds in a month is ridiculous. That is 3840 coins in a month. Seems like a major revenue channel lost. I have explained this too. Suggest you spend some time reading and understanding business models. 

    I am not talking about coherence from an English language or subject perspective. That is fine. Even Google translate or will spew out correct spellings. That isn't the point. Most of what you say is nothing but conspiracy theories at best. And you are just there EVERYWHERE. If there's garbage everywhere you just can't ignore it can you. 

    Said it before, will say it again, back up your data with facts, not conspiracy theories. You actually do bring up a valid point at times. But they get lost in all the conspiracy theories you keep putting up. I have been here and hence I speak for myself. Kix's business model is that of catering to the P2W model. Upto us to see if you like it or not. If you don't just quit. Are you sure you need so much negativity in your life? It obviously causes so much grief to you. Why play? 
    That's one way of looking at it, but it's a very baseline view. Sure, on the surface it's X amount of coins lost in a month. However, reality is a lot more complicated than that. In reality, it's not that X amount of coins is lost, it is X amount of coins may not be spent. The difference is that those coins are not guaranteed.

    Players spend coins for many different reasons and also refuse to spend coins for many different reasons. Perhaps players are going to see that Kixeye halved the rewards, and determine that this is not a company they want to spend money or time on. This would result in less revenue, despite them giving away less free coins. On the flip side, the additional activity from players who are willing to invest their time in the Token Riots when they are at the increased rate may result in more revenue because the more time someone spends playing a game, the higher they value it and the more likely they are to spend money on it.

    These are all things that have to be considered when making buisness (which in this case is tied directly to game design) decisions, and I fear that you, along with Kixeye, only look through a simplified lens of: "Give less, lose less". By that logic, removing all Time Tokens would result in Kixeye losing less money, when in actuality, it would most likely lead to them losing more. Perhaps you are the one who needs to brush up on your business principles ;)
  • karthik Gopalan
    karthik Gopalan
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Feb 2015 Posts: 466

    You can't farm refit tokens [ ya ya riots here is that issue...] I use to but kixeye did what they do and cut the rewards in half but left the points needed the same.. not cool at all and makes no sense...

    It's pretty easy to read what I type, I do try. Just looking for an answer as what they say seldom matches what they do.

    Why be against a fellow player trying to push for a more rewarding game?

    And i do try to stick to only a few topics I feel would make great changes for players of all levels.

    Lastly as said before no one is forcing you to read or reply to me so why do it? You can block me at anytime why you and others chose not to , well that's a interesting question.

    Kix cut the rewards because 4 days of refits/builds was too much. Which in high sight, I agree with. I can get an operational Bastion out in 8 days. If I plan it such that I get two riots done in 8 days, I will literally have the ship done for free. See the issue ? 16 days of refits/builds in a month is ridiculous. That is 3840 coins in a month. Seems like a major revenue channel lost. I have explained this too. Suggest you spend some time reading and understanding business models. 

    I am not talking about coherence from an English language or subject perspective. That is fine. Even Google translate or will spew out correct spellings. That isn't the point. Most of what you say is nothing but conspiracy theories at best. And you are just there EVERYWHERE. If there's garbage everywhere you just can't ignore it can you. 

    Said it before, will say it again, back up your data with facts, not conspiracy theories. You actually do bring up a valid point at times. But they get lost in all the conspiracy theories you keep putting up. I have been here and hence I speak for myself. Kix's business model is that of catering to the P2W model. Upto us to see if you like it or not. If you don't just quit. Are you sure you need so much negativity in your life? It obviously causes so much grief to you. Why play? 
    That's one way of looking at it, but it's a very baseline view. Sure, on the surface it's X amount of coins lost in a month. However, reality is a lot more complicated than that. In reality, it's not that X amount of coins is lost, it is X amount of coins may not be spent. The difference is that those coins are not guaranteed.

    Players spend coins for many different reasons and also refuse to spend coins for many different reasons. Perhaps players are going to see that Kixeye halved the rewards, and determine that this is not a company they want to spend money or time on. This would result in less revenue, despite them giving away less free coins. On the flip side, the additional activity from players who are willing to invest their time in the Token Riots when they are at the increased rate may result in more revenue because the more time someone spends playing a game, the higher they value it and the more likely they are to spend money on it.

    These are all things that have to be considered when making buisness (which in this case is tied directly to game design) decisions, and I fear that you, along with Kixeye, only look through a simplified lens of: "Give less, lose less". By that logic, removing all Time Tokens would result in Kixeye losing less money, when in actuality, it would most likely lead to them losing more. Perhaps you are the one who needs to brush up on your business principles ;)
    So first of all, I never said this was MY business principle. I said it is business principle. They are all PRINCIPLE's NOT FACTS. Fact is "SUN RISES IN THE EAST" P2W is a business principle. NOT A FACT. You and I can sit and argue over the benefits over such a model and what is the right model etc, but this is MY understanding of what KIX is doing. And it helps me keep moving along. 

    What players spend on, are neither known to you, nor me. So like you said earlier, since you ARE NOT A SPOKESPERSON for the people here, let us know presume to know what people spend their money on. I can only make conclusions based on my understanding. You are DOING THE SAME. And since KIX will not divulge actual data on anything from no of actual users to may of the other things asked for (even % not actual numbers would have helped), all we can do is SPECULATE. If my explanation doesn't suffice then pray tell me, why were the riots reduced? If all is hunky dory? If you have other PLAUSIBLE THEORIES put them forward. Happy to hear them. 

    I have always said that spending 100$ on a game doesn't make sense for me. But to others it does. I have a monthly limit. And I spend within my limitations. Lower the packages, increase people to buy more etc have all been mentioned plenty of times. To no avail. Hence I have a choice. I either choose to spend time within these limitations and play the game. Or I can quit. Because the other options aren't open to us. And if you haven't, then I suggest you spend the good hr of time and see the video's posted by KIX on the forum interaction % etc. Well worth it.

    Context is set. Upto you if you want to play it that way or not play at all. 



  • Aletheides
    Aletheides
    Force to be Reckoned With
    Joined Dec 2015 Posts: 1,669
    Kixeye gets statistical data from the game pretty much live. This will tell them if a decision is affecting their bottom line or not or if its deviating from the targets of the game. Based on that they can change anything pretty much anytime when it comes to amounts of rewards like tokens etc.

    Kixeye have not increased the token payout. This in itself should tell everyone that they see no issues with the results of their current path. Anyone claiming they have no business sense or have no idea what they are doing need to substantiate that because it stinks of unsubstantiated conspiracy theories.
  • Struan Robertson
    Struan Robertson
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Feb 2018 Posts: 319

    What are we supposed to do with the millions of points we get killing motherships for sovereign boxes? I'm not even that high level of a player and I literally have no use for them.

    I scored over 27 million points form the last event, I just bought all the level items form the store and worked my way down the list
  • Jamie Helm
    Jamie Helm
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Mar 2016 Posts: 928

    Everyone can talk all days about business model, data and the like but it won’t change anything for either sides arguments. It is Kix game, and they have shown how they operate multiple times, no one should be surprised at anything by now. You can’t teach an old dog new tricks....kinda...dont snopes check that please ;)

    But, to get on topic here, it’s great to finally see elite tokens make a return, and the insta credit xeno lancer driver are welcome, if somewhat expensive ;).

    It would have been nice to see a return of some of those plasma and alien resonant armours, but beggars can’t be choosers.

    Inquisitor boxes from non fortress targets is also very welcome, just wish it did not stop at mk 3.

    Overall, a nice change of pace in this event.

  • Mabari
    Mabari
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Aug 2015 Posts: 164

    @CM_Lee said:
    SEAL Corps1 said:

    Are the L110 Vanguards supposed to drop M6 Cavalier fragments or its supposed to be Bastion? 

    Double checked the event list and this is correct, the fragment drop is for Cutters. Looks like the pattern around all 110's is the box drop is different from the fragments to spread it around. 

    If decimation is latest tech why aren't they altarian refit tokens? Or blank, could you please answer that? Also void /plasma armor? CW is coming...

    Can we please ensure that everyone has fitted as much plasma armour as possible for the upcoming civil war. Thank you
  • Noah Fougere
    Noah Fougere
    Potential Threat
    Joined Dec 2016 Posts: 27

    @Struan Robertson said:
    Noah Fougere said:

    What are we supposed to do with the millions of points we get killing motherships for sovereign boxes? I'm not even that high level of a player and I literally have no use for them.

    I scored over 27 million points form the last event, I just bought all the level items form the store and worked my way down the list

    There's NOTHING TO BUY in this event. Ships we all have already, axis refit tokens we don't want because we're all pumping out altairian ships, and resources we filled up on in the last couple events.

  • treecats
    treecats
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Dec 2013 Posts: 127
    treecats said:
    @CM_Lee
    Where is Xeno Munitions BP? We are waiting for this to come back for a few month now.  Please add it to the event store.
    The Xeno Munitions RI was in the last S&G. 
    They are not.  I am talking about the Xeno Munitions used on the ship.  They are Blueprints.  If they are Blueprints, they will never come out as RI.
    The ones you are talking about is for the base use.
  • Coelus
    Coelus
    Incursion Leader
    Joined Jul 2015 Posts: 1,129

    Is this just an event thrown together so you can use it as an excuse in 6mo when the players start asking where the axis elite credits and refit tokens have been again?


  • Struan Robertson
    Struan Robertson
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Feb 2018 Posts: 319
    edited 12 Jul 2018, 2:16PM

    @Struan Robertson said:
    Noah Fougere said:

    What are we supposed to do with the millions of points we get killing motherships for sovereign boxes? I'm not even that high level of a player and I literally have no use for them.

    I scored over 27 million points form the last event, I just bought all the level items form the store and worked my way down the list

    There's NOTHING TO BUY in this event. Ships we all have already, axis refit tokens we don't want because we're all pumping out altairian ships, and resources we filled up on in the last couple events.

    Most people have many AXIS ships awaiting ELITE tokens, plus all the FREE Xeno weapons 3 of which will save you 20-24 hours in crafting.

    If you are lucky enough to have gotten a Paladin for FREE in one of the past 4 events AND crafted it up to MK4/5 from the basicly free crafting events, you would be able to refit that ship for free ant instantly with the 12 days of free refit tokens coupled with the 20% discount on refit this weekend.

    But by all means don't do this event, I will enjoy all of my FREE items (I can do a regiment 110 for way less than 30 minutes repair - that was how I was able to accumulate the 27 million points)


  • Sequestor
    Sequestor
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Aug 2013 Posts: 934
    Actually, i need none of these items from the store, at all. I only care about some lower level players, who may need elite upgrades, which became way too rare.
  • Stormer-M
    Stormer-M
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Nov 2016 Posts: 729
    Sequestor said:
    Actually, i need none of these items from the store, at all. I only care about some lower level players, who may need elite upgrades, which became way too rare.
    But the event difficulty is always scaled toward the high level players....
  • LilBasterd
    LilBasterd
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Mar 2018 Posts: 458

    @Mabari said:
    LilBasterd said:

    @CM_Lee said:

    SEAL Corps1 said:

    Are the L110 Vanguards supposed to drop M6 Cavalier fragments or its supposed to be Bastion? 
    

    Double checked the event list and this is correct, the fragment drop is for Cutters. Looks like the pattern around all 110's is the box drop is different from the fragments to spread it around. 

    If decimation is latest tech why aren't they altarian refit tokens? Or blank, could you please answer that? Also void /plasma armor? CW is coming...

    Can we please ensure that everyone has fitted as much plasma armour as possible for the upcoming civil war. Thank you

    Well ahem what you don't know is I have plasma weapons.... void is for CW.... plasma because who knows when they will give us more next....

  • shyva prime
    shyva prime
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Nov 2014 Posts: 327
    plasma being the damage dealt by every top PvE fleet , i am fitting all the bastion and such with plasma resistor and armor .

    as for PvP , now that T7 marauder is being released with the blackguard to begin with , using bastion in PvP is just not very clever
  • LilBasterd
    LilBasterd
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Mar 2018 Posts: 458
    plasma being the damage dealt by every top PvE fleet , i am fitting all the bastion and such with plasma resistor and armor .

    as for PvP , now that T7 marauder is being released with the blackguard to begin with , using bastion in PvP is just not very clever
    well ahem thats why we need more void armor
  • Gary Pollock
    Gary Pollock
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Oct 2016 Posts: 917
    plasma being the damage dealt by every top PvE fleet , i am fitting all the bastion and such with plasma resistor and armor .

    as for PvP , now that T7 marauder is being released with the blackguard to begin with , using bastion in PvP is just not very clever
    Why not plasma shield instead of armor?
  • Sequestor
    Sequestor
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Aug 2013 Posts: 934
    Why not plasma shield instead of armor?
    Why "instead"? He didn't say anything about shields, one can assume that plasma shields are used by default, while plasma resistor and armor help reduce the health damage taken.
  • LilBasterd
    LilBasterd
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Mar 2018 Posts: 458
    because the shield is a BP and  most everyone already got it, but kixeye saw in their grand all knowing intelligence saw fit to not make armors into BPs
  • shyva prime
    shyva prime
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Nov 2014 Posts: 327
    plasma being the damage dealt by every top PvE fleet , i am fitting all the bastion and such with plasma resistor and armor .

    as for PvP , now that T7 marauder is being released with the blackguard to begin with , using bastion in PvP is just not very clever
    Why not plasma shield instead of armor?
    Sequestor said:
    Why not plasma shield instead of armor?
    Why "instead"? He didn't say anything about shields, one can assume that plasma shields are used by default, while plasma resistor and armor help reduce the health damage taken.
    yes , i am using plasma shell for 4 of my 5 bastion ( the 5th one need energy to tank the enemy sov ) 

    when the enemy bastion get in overdrive , the 300% damage + 40% shield bypass will melt any shield that not plasma , and the shield bypass will cause severe hull damage , that why i'm focusing so much on plasma resistance in addition to shield .


    also with the fact that next season will not have shield  , it's kinda like yelling to the playerbase " hey guys , your shield will be kinda pointless "
    meaning having strong hull resistance will probably be the key .

    then again , i do not know for sure x)




    getting back on subject , plasma shield can tank low lvl fleet that are not using plasma damage easily , and then they become usefull at higher lvl when everything is plasma and put other shield type to shame .

  • Mabari
    Mabari
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Aug 2015 Posts: 164

    @Mabari said:
    LilBasterd said:

    @CM_Lee said:

    SEAL Corps1 said:

    Are the L110 Vanguards supposed to drop M6 Cavalier fragments or its supposed to be Bastion? 
    

    Double checked the event list and this is correct, the fragment drop is for Cutters. Looks like the pattern around all 110's is the box drop is different from the fragments to spread it around. 

    If decimation is latest tech why aren't they altarian refit tokens? Or blank, could you please answer that? Also void /plasma armor? CW is coming...

    Can we please ensure that everyone has fitted as much plasma armour as possible for the upcoming civil war. Thank you

    Well ahem what you don't know is I have plasma weapons.... void is for CW.... plasma because who knows when they will give us more next....

    Any time I think you might be on to something, I will re-read this statement.

    Good luck with your plasma equipped ships and I hope I don't run into your plasma weapons anytime soon.

  • LilBasterd
    LilBasterd
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Mar 2018 Posts: 458
    Mabari said:

    Any time I think you might be on to something, I will re-read this statement.

    Good luck with your plasma equipped ships and I hope I don't run into your plasma weapons anytime soon.

    your odds are 50/50
  • Gary Pollock
    Gary Pollock
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Oct 2016 Posts: 917
    edited 12 Jul 2018, 9:16PM
    plasma being the damage dealt by every top PvE fleet , i am fitting all the bastion and such with plasma resistor and armor .

    as for PvP , now that T7 marauder is being released with the blackguard to begin with , using bastion in PvP is just not very clever
    Why not plasma shield instead of armor?
    Sequestor said:
    Why not plasma shield instead of armor?
    Why "instead"? He didn't say anything about shields, one can assume that plasma shields are used by default, while plasma resistor and armor help reduce the health damage taken.
    yes , i am using plasma shell for 4 of my 5 bastion ( the 5th one need energy to tank the enemy sov ) 

    when the enemy bastion get in overdrive , the 300% damage + 40% shield bypass will melt any shield that not plasma , and the shield bypass will cause severe hull damage , that why i'm focusing so much on plasma resistance in addition to shield .


    also with the fact that next season will not have shield  , it's kinda like yelling to the playerbase " hey guys , your shield will be kinda pointless "
    meaning having strong hull resistance will probably be the key .

    then again , i do not know for sure x)




    getting back on subject , plasma shield can tank low lvl fleet that are not using plasma damage easily , and then they become usefull at higher lvl when everything is plasma and put other shield type to shame
    Right, I see where you coming from, good point on having a ****** bastion to tank the sovereign. I use my ****** sovereign for that whilst all my bastions are ****** shell at the moment with ******* armor which i am in the process of refitting to *******.

    Will also be refitting resistors to *******.
  • FreeMann2018
    FreeMann2018
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Mar 2018 Posts: 184
    edited 12 Jul 2018, 8:24PM
    At this point ... i dont want to share any info of my ships/fleets fitting .. kixeye uses all the information that we expose here, to adjust its own content and deny all our effort and time.

    So, my advice, be careful with the info you write here, kixeye takes notes ...
    image
    "Don´t bite the hand that feeds you" should be the motto of any legal company.
  • Daniel Rose
    Daniel Rose
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Jul 2016 Posts: 592
    Kixeye gets statistical data from the game pretty much live. This will tell them if a decision is affecting their bottom line or not or if its deviating from the targets of the game. Based on that they can change anything pretty much anytime when it comes to amounts of rewards like tokens etc.

    Kixeye have not increased the token payout. This in itself should tell everyone that they see no issues with the results of their current path. Anyone claiming they have no business sense or have no idea what they are doing need to substantiate that because it stinks of unsubstantiated conspiracy theories.
    https://steamcharts.com/app/339600
    Substantiated. They are currently at the lowest amount of players they have ever had and are still losing. I don't think this is their intent as a business.

    You can't farm refit tokens [ ya ya riots here is that issue...] I use to but kixeye did what they do and cut the rewards in half but left the points needed the same.. not cool at all and makes no sense...

    It's pretty easy to read what I type, I do try. Just looking for an answer as what they say seldom matches what they do.

    Why be against a fellow player trying to push for a more rewarding game?

    And i do try to stick to only a few topics I feel would make great changes for players of all levels.

    Lastly as said before no one is forcing you to read or reply to me so why do it? You can block me at anytime why you and others chose not to , well that's a interesting question.

    Kix cut the rewards because 4 days of refits/builds was too much. Which in high sight, I agree with. I can get an operational Bastion out in 8 days. If I plan it such that I get two riots done in 8 days, I will literally have the ship done for free. See the issue ? 16 days of refits/builds in a month is ridiculous. That is 3840 coins in a month. Seems like a major revenue channel lost. I have explained this too. Suggest you spend some time reading and understanding business models. 

    I am not talking about coherence from an English language or subject perspective. That is fine. Even Google translate or will spew out correct spellings. That isn't the point. Most of what you say is nothing but conspiracy theories at best. And you are just there EVERYWHERE. If there's garbage everywhere you just can't ignore it can you. 

    Said it before, will say it again, back up your data with facts, not conspiracy theories. You actually do bring up a valid point at times. But they get lost in all the conspiracy theories you keep putting up. I have been here and hence I speak for myself. Kix's business model is that of catering to the P2W model. Upto us to see if you like it or not. If you don't just quit. Are you sure you need so much negativity in your life? It obviously causes so much grief to you. Why play? 
    That's one way of looking at it, but it's a very baseline view. Sure, on the surface it's X amount of coins lost in a month. However, reality is a lot more complicated than that. In reality, it's not that X amount of coins is lost, it is X amount of coins may not be spent. The difference is that those coins are not guaranteed.

    Players spend coins for many different reasons and also refuse to spend coins for many different reasons. Perhaps players are going to see that Kixeye halved the rewards, and determine that this is not a company they want to spend money or time on. This would result in less revenue, despite them giving away less free coins. On the flip side, the additional activity from players who are willing to invest their time in the Token Riots when they are at the increased rate may result in more revenue because the more time someone spends playing a game, the higher they value it and the more likely they are to spend money on it.

    These are all things that have to be considered when making buisness (which in this case is tied directly to game design) decisions, and I fear that you, along with Kixeye, only look through a simplified lens of: "Give less, lose less". By that logic, removing all Time Tokens would result in Kixeye losing less money, when in actuality, it would most likely lead to them losing more. Perhaps you are the one who needs to brush up on your business principles ;)
    So first of all, I never said this was MY business principle. I said it is business principle. They are all PRINCIPLE's NOT FACTS. Fact is "SUN RISES IN THE EAST" P2W is a business principle. NOT A FACT. You and I can sit and argue over the benefits over such a model and what is the right model etc, but this is MY understanding of what KIX is doing. And it helps me keep moving along. 

    What players spend on, are neither known to you, nor me. So like you said earlier, since you ARE NOT A SPOKESPERSON for the people here, let us know presume to know what people spend their money on. I can only make conclusions based on my understanding. You are DOING THE SAME. And since KIX will not divulge actual data on anything from no of actual users to may of the other things asked for (even % not actual numbers would have helped), all we can do is SPECULATE. If my explanation doesn't suffice then pray tell me, why were the riots reduced? If all is hunky dory? If you have other PLAUSIBLE THEORIES put them forward. Happy to hear them. 

    I have always said that spending 100$ on a game doesn't make sense for me. But to others it does. I have a monthly limit. And I spend within my limitations. Lower the packages, increase people to buy more etc have all been mentioned plenty of times. To no avail. Hence I have a choice. I either choose to spend time within these limitations and play the game. Or I can quit. Because the other options aren't open to us. And if you haven't, then I suggest you spend the good hr of time and see the video's posted by KIX on the forum interaction % etc. Well worth it.

    Context is set. Upto you if you want to play it that way or not play at all.
    You are right, we don't know exactly what causes people to spend, which is why everything I said had a "perhaps" or "may" instead of claiming them as hard set facts. Also you kinda did say it was your principle when you agreed with it...:P I wasn't arguing if that is why they changed the riots, I was arguing as to why that isn't a realistically good reason to change the riots, as you were toting. I have watched parts of the video, and again they didn't provide the numbers to backup the "1% of player base is on forums" which means it could be a completely fabricated number. Personally I suspect the percent is much higher, but we have no way of actually knowing because they don't release any of these numbers to us. The fact that they don't makes it seem like they are hiding something...Finally, just a little semantics issue, Pay to Win is a business model which is made up of principles.
  • FreeMann2018
    FreeMann2018
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Mar 2018 Posts: 184
    That graph only represents the number of players through steam ... I do not even want to think about the number of users of mobile devices, who stop playing at vega conflict, due to the little consideration that kixeye has of them.
    image
    "Don´t bite the hand that feeds you" should be the motto of any legal company.
  • Aletheides
    Aletheides
    Force to be Reckoned With
    Joined Dec 2015 Posts: 1,669
    @Daniel Rose Theres also the web platform. I almost exclusively play through browser as i dont want to lock up my steam account with Vega as i use it to play real games at the other computer at the same time. So player numbers on steam arent saying much for the big picture. We also dont know what the targets are for Vega within Kixeye. For many businesses its acceptable for engagement to drop as churn is expected late in the life of a product like this. This as long as other measures are according to plan to compensate for that.

    Many free to play games, that are as aggressive with the pay to win business-model as Kixeye is, lean heavily on the free to play portion of their product at the start of its life to grow the playerbase as fast as possible. The more players they feed through their net early in its life, the higher the retention rate will be of people who bite on all the baits they have put into their product and become paying customers. When the game reaches maturity though its common to gradually start to lean on the pay to win features and ramp those up to milk the fish that stuck in your net ever so gently. This will lead to churn and thats acceptable as long as growth balances for that usually. Late in its lifetime when churn is starting to take its toll the owners of games like this usually go into the final phase of the game. Meaning really lean on the pay to win features to really squeeze every drop out of the remaining playerbase and especially targeting the addicts/whales. This keeps the game within the acceptable profit margins and compensates for the late life churn while giving the developer time and funds to produce the next product.

    It has similarities with how online casinos operate and im pretty sure both branches lean heavily on behavioural sciences. For Casinos the system to lure people into the gambling treadmill targets the same kinds of dopamine based reward system we have in our brains and creates addiction. Casions then data-mine their users and find whos the obvious addicts or "big players" then target them with special offers and rewards thats aimed to get them to spend even more. And if one of them obviously are quitting gambling, as can be seen by the statistical data live as well, then they are targeted with special offers and free chips to get them back into playing again and addicts to relapse. This is a business that thrive on addicts.

    Im not saying this is what kixeye is doing, none of us have access to their internal documentation. But this is standard practice in the pay to win genre. Knowing what to expect helps avoid frustration and cuts down on "armchair developers" demanding changes that doesn't make sense within the proper context. Wishing, or screaming for, this genre to be anything different than what it is, is an exercise in futility.
  • LilBasterd
    LilBasterd
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Mar 2018 Posts: 458


    You are right, we don't know exactly what causes people to spend, which is why everything I said had a "perhaps" or "may" instead of claiming them as hard set facts. Also you kinda did say it was your principle when you agreed with it...:P I wasn't arguing if that is why they changed the riots, I was arguing as to why that isn't a realistically good reason to change the riots, as you were toting. I have watched parts of the video, and again they didn't provide the numbers to backup the "1% of player base is on forums" which means it could be a completely fabricated number. Personally I suspect the percent is much higher, but we have no way of actually knowing because they don't release any of these numbers to us. The fact that they don't makes it seem like they are hiding something...Finally, just a little semantics issue, Pay to Win is a business model which is made up of principles.
    well for one competition, kids with parents credits cards, impatience
Sign In or Register to comment.