A non-coiner's approach to BP

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  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 7,490
    one next thought is to make one of your buccs have 4 c1c, and use that as your primary tank in the short term. i will likely do this I think.

    also with these targets, if they're similar to the legion target, dont forget to pinch.
  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 7,490
    Another quick comment on tokens and planning for the raid.

    There's a chance we get both limited flags as prizes in the raid as this has happened before.  Assuming each is around a 12 day build blank to get it ready for VXP weekend I need the following build time saved up:

    7 days elapsed time from winning the prize to the vxp weekend
    5 days tokens from the raid
    6 days tokens from the FM after the raid
    5 days tokens from saved chests
    1 day of saved tokens from the fm two weeks before the raid.

    That means i can spend all but one day of tokens from the FM from last week, and still be okay for the raid. Having said that i'll save more than the one day of tokens until we know what the raid prizes are, and for last minute refits at the start of the raid if i've got a build wrong with my buccs.


  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 7,490
    edited 7 Jan 2018, 11:25AM
    Legion 120s for dummies.

    So first thing is to ensure they don't despawn on you, so I generally hit them just after a spawn.

    Next, you need to bring in either a fang or hunter fleet.

    Fangs can do it for zero damage. I generally hit the first ones that come out towards the top left torp tower. Then i pull the top right (offscreen ships). Followed by centre, then bottom. You kind of kite them so that you can escape around in a circle rather than just in a straight line and get trapped.

    Hunters are actually my preferred option. I use the top left torp tower to splash any incoming ships as much as possible to minimise damage. After that I will kite them with only 1 in my range at a time to minimise damage. If i really want to minimise damage I will retreat to recharge my apex (i tank with that as much as possible as it has better resists). I like this option as I enjoy bulldozing rather than finesse, and its quite a bit faster. The downside is its up to a three hour repair, although if you recharge, splash properly you can reduce that quite a bit.

    For the siege part its actually quite simple. The one key thing is to never get caught in a fire field. That means every time the fire field turret fires you should be moving, and moving in a straight line, preferably not right up close to the turret. That means sometimes i will drive away rather than stay to destroy the turret. The other turret to kind of watch for is the blunderbuss turret, as you can outrange that one without it even firing.

    Now if you want to give away charged armors to smaller players, you can simply destroy all the turrets, and then let them destroy the buildings.

    I also think the chests are weighted for prizes as I only have one c1c out of almost 20 legions. Or perhaps i'm just really unlucky.


  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 7,490
    Buccaneers

    So based on the feedback from the preview server, CMs appear to be a necessity - particularly for George's auto buccs.

    I think i'll switch out one bucc to a CM ship with a phal or two and maybe some sprints. Yeah i know the sprints should be on other ships so that the phalanx can outrange the sprints, but i just am too lazy to switch that much stuff around.

    Build will be basically the same, but no autoloader and use the cm reload special, and flcs instead of siege battery.

    I'm also moving to the critical special that now works instead of autoloader. (probably)
  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 7,490
    edited 11 Jan 2018, 9:38AM
    So heading towards the raid, i've saved tokens mostly as planned.

    By far and away the top priority is to get the Bucc flag. It repairs at literally eight times the efficiency of the regular buc, so it will drastically improve my raid capability. Even if i just keep it as a blank for repairing fleets between targets (whilst also repairing during targets).

    In other news with the late change to charged armor ....

    it makes exactly zero change to my plans.

    i do have my one tank with 4 charged armor, and ended up adding one siege cannon for the speed bonus, so that it will lead when on auto. should be a simple raid.
  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 7,490
    edited 11 Jan 2018, 9:12PM
    so ... Zoe's Gamble.

    Read all the tears about the tier 8 targets so decided to try tier 7 first - all on auto.

    81: 7 minute repair
    83: 14 minute repair (instant in base)
    85: 49 minute repair.

    Down to 7 minutes on an 85 if you dont stop in a fire field.

    here was my first auto of the 85. you can see wher it stopped and tooka  ton of damage.



    i ended up with only 6 cannons on 3 ships, 4 on the cm one.  2 phal 4 and 2 sprints on my cm ship, 1 sprints on two of my other buccs. (yes i know i took a gamble putting sprints on my cm ship ... it was probably a mistake. i was tired at the time).


    Actually driving an 85 for very little damage



    On continuing autoing, i lost a whole ship on an 83 ... it must have driven off by itself. annoying. 

  • travis.clair
    travis.clair
    Greenhorn
    Joined Apr 2013 Posts: 3
    bort said:

    Thought I’d start a new semi-guide on my approach to the game, initially covering the following topics, which there are a number I need to flesh out.

    • ·        Overall
    • ·        Raids
    • ·        Shipbuilds
    • ·        FM
    • ·        TLC
    • ·        Ranking
    • ·        Catching up
    • ·        Base defence

     

    Overall

    I strongly believed a skilled non-coiner can keep up with this game. And relatively easily at that these days. You are trying to keep ahead of the masses, as that is where the difficulty is of the game is generally balanced to. You need to build smarter and approach targets smarter than the average player and you will be able to keep up. It is literally as simple as that. It does mean though, that you may need to sacrifice some PvP elements in the short term – particularly if you are behind the power curve.

    How do you build and approach targets smarter than average? Well, either figure it out for yourself, or look at the many available resources around on approaches that work. Coiners are my friends. They often test out what works and what doesn’t work before I even have to consider my builds.

    The whole game is simply a series of challenges and puzzles. You can make a choice – either whine about it, or try to figure it out. I will always try to figure it out, and in 99% of cases there is a way to meet the challenge without spending a single coin.

    When something is newly released, my first thought is simply, it is what it is, and it is the same for everyone. So, how can I use it to get further ahead in my game? That being said, if it’s not going to get me further in game, then I’m still likely to get it, although not as a huge priority, just to ensure it doesn’t set me back on the FM at some stage, or alternately it becomes a useful item in future, or I’ve misjudged its value.

     

    I call BS. You start over and not coin and see how far you get. You are able use that approach because you started with much stronger ships, hulls and prizes that you got because you coined. I coined for a while and stopped, now my fleets are so far behind there is no way to ever catch up. You start from the beginning and record your progress then I will believe that a non-coiner can make it in this game now. Until then BS.
  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 7,490
    edited 11 Jan 2018, 11:58PM
    bort said:

    Thought I’d start a new semi-guide on my approach to the game, initially covering the following topics, which there are a number I need to flesh out.

    • ·        Overall
    • ·        Raids
    • ·        Shipbuilds
    • ·        FM
    • ·        TLC
    • ·        Ranking
    • ·        Catching up
    • ·        Base defence

     

    Overall

    I strongly believed a skilled non-coiner can keep up with this game. And relatively easily at that these days. You are trying to keep ahead of the masses, as that is where the difficulty is of the game is generally balanced to. You need to build smarter and approach targets smarter than the average player and you will be able to keep up. It is literally as simple as that. It does mean though, that you may need to sacrifice some PvP elements in the short term – particularly if you are behind the power curve.

    How do you build and approach targets smarter than average? Well, either figure it out for yourself, or look at the many available resources around on approaches that work. Coiners are my friends. They often test out what works and what doesn’t work before I even have to consider my builds.

    The whole game is simply a series of challenges and puzzles. You can make a choice – either whine about it, or try to figure it out. I will always try to figure it out, and in 99% of cases there is a way to meet the challenge without spending a single coin.

    When something is newly released, my first thought is simply, it is what it is, and it is the same for everyone. So, how can I use it to get further ahead in my game? That being said, if it’s not going to get me further in game, then I’m still likely to get it, although not as a huge priority, just to ensure it doesn’t set me back on the FM at some stage, or alternately it becomes a useful item in future, or I’ve misjudged its value.

     

    I call BS. You start over and not coin and see how far you get. You are able use that approach because you started with much stronger ships, hulls and prizes that you got because you coined. I coined for a while and stopped, now my fleets are so far behind there is no way to ever catch up. You start from the beginning and record your progress then I will believe that a non-coiner can make it in this game now. Until then BS.
    i have started over multiple times, using no coins. all documented in the guide section. how i've done this account is also documented on and off in a number of different threads

    i have never coined.

    here you go, one example, going back to 2012 https://www.kixeye.com/forum/discussion/280508/p1 

    you can call BS all you like. but you'd be wrong.
  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 7,490
    Anyways. Back to the raid.

    Just picked up my bucc flag, mostly autoing 80s sets, and will build it in 20 mins when my siege cruiser is done. Then the raid just gets a whole lot easier again. 

    I will build it blank, and then build a blank hyrdra flag. I need to do a token check to see if i have time to build an extra regular cruiser for vxp weekend. think i should have enough. 

    I could do refits, but i'm going to easily get enough points with what i have half done.
  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 7,490
    edited 12 Jan 2018, 10:39PM
    exactly what my ships look like for the raid (yes there are mistakes in there):



    plus my new boon that is used for repairs (and ooops accidentally left it running on auto in an 83. it didnt last long....)



    I tried my first tier 7 target using it too.

    What i've found is if i dont stack my ships and use my one tank a bit separate from the others, i only needed to retreat a couple times from the target to finish it. Ended up taking me around 9 minutes total to do it, and gave me an hour of repairs.

    About the same seat time as doing a tier 6 set, maybe slightly shorter, but had to drive rather than mostly auto. 

    The other thing about tier 6 is that my boon repairs faster than the rate that i get damaged at doing tier 6 on auto. So whenever i log in I can just auto a tier 6 target.
  • Hawkpanther
    Hawkpanther
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Oct 2012 Posts: 900
    bort said:
    Legion 120s for dummies.

    So first thing is to ensure they don't despawn on you, so I generally hit them just after a spawn.

    Next, you need to bring in either a fang or hunter fleet.

    Fangs can do it for zero damage. I generally hit the first ones that come out towards the top left torp tower. Then i pull the top right (offscreen ships). Followed by centre, then bottom. You kind of kite them so that you can escape around in a circle rather than just in a straight line and get trapped.

    Hunters are actually my preferred option. I use the top left torp tower to splash any incoming ships as much as possible to minimise damage. After that I will kite them with only 1 in my range at a time to minimise damage. If i really want to minimise damage I will retreat to recharge my apex (i tank with that as much as possible as it has better resists). I like this option as I enjoy bulldozing rather than finesse, and its quite a bit faster. The downside is its up to a three hour repair, although if you recharge, splash properly you can reduce that quite a bit.

    For the siege part its actually quite simple. The one key thing is to never get caught in a fire field. That means every time the fire field turret fires you should be moving, and moving in a straight line, preferably not right up close to the turret. That means sometimes i will drive away rather than stay to destroy the turret. The other turret to kind of watch for is the blunderbuss turret, as you can outrange that one without it even firing.

    Now if you want to give away charged armors to smaller players, you can simply destroy all the turrets, and then let them destroy the buildings.

    I also think the chests are weighted for prizes as I only have one c1c out of almost 20 legions. Or perhaps i'm just really unlucky.


    I had about a 5% drop rate for C & 10% for X

  • rob.swift.948494
    rob.swift.948494
    Potential Threat
    Joined May 2013 Posts: 76
    edited 13 Jan 2018, 8:15AM
    bort said:
    bort said:

    Thought I’d start a new semi-guide on my approach to the game, initially covering the following topics, which there are a number I need to flesh out.

    • ·        Overall
    • ·        Raids
    • ·        Shipbuilds
    • ·        FM
    • ·        TLC
    • ·        Ranking
    • ·        Catching up
    • ·        Base defence

     

    Overall

    I strongly believed a skilled non-coiner can keep up with this game. And relatively easily at that these days. You are trying to keep ahead of the masses, as that is where the difficulty is of the game is generally balanced to. You need to build smarter and approach targets smarter than the average player and you will be able to keep up. It is literally as simple as that. It does mean though, that you may need to sacrifice some PvP elements in the short term – particularly if you are behind the power curve.

    How do you build and approach targets smarter than average? Well, either figure it out for yourself, or look at the many available resources around on approaches that work. Coiners are my friends. They often test out what works and what doesn’t work before I even have to consider my builds.

    The whole game is simply a series of challenges and puzzles. You can make a choice – either whine about it, or try to figure it out. I will always try to figure it out, and in 99% of cases there is a way to meet the challenge without spending a single coin.

    When something is newly released, my first thought is simply, it is what it is, and it is the same for everyone. So, how can I use it to get further ahead in my game? That being said, if it’s not going to get me further in game, then I’m still likely to get it, although not as a huge priority, just to ensure it doesn’t set me back on the FM at some stage, or alternately it becomes a useful item in future, or I’ve misjudged its value.

     

    I call BS. You start over and not coin and see how far you get. You are able use that approach because you started with much stronger ships, hulls and prizes that you got because you coined. I coined for a while and stopped, now my fleets are so far behind there is no way to ever catch up. You start from the beginning and record your progress then I will believe that a non-coiner can make it in this game now. Until then BS.
    i have started over multiple times, using no coins. all documented in the guide section. how i've done this account is also documented on and off in a number of different threads

    i have never coined.

    here you go, one example, going back to 2012 https://www.kixeye.com/forum/discussion/280508/p1 

    you can call BS all you like. but you'd be wrong.
    thats why in your earlier vids you have the coin section covered so people cant see how many coin you have!  if you did not coin no reason to block it  !!!

  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 7,490
    edited 13 Jan 2018, 8:14AM
    bort said:
    bort said:

    Thought I’d start a new semi-guide on my approach to the game, initially covering the following topics, which there are a number I need to flesh out.

    • ·        Overall
    • ·        Raids
    • ·        Shipbuilds
    • ·        FM
    • ·        TLC
    • ·        Ranking
    • ·        Catching up
    • ·        Base defence

     

    Overall

    I strongly believed a skilled non-coiner can keep up with this game. And relatively easily at that these days. You are trying to keep ahead of the masses, as that is where the difficulty is of the game is generally balanced to. You need to build smarter and approach targets smarter than the average player and you will be able to keep up. It is literally as simple as that. It does mean though, that you may need to sacrifice some PvP elements in the short term – particularly if you are behind the power curve.

    How do you build and approach targets smarter than average? Well, either figure it out for yourself, or look at the many available resources around on approaches that work. Coiners are my friends. They often test out what works and what doesn’t work before I even have to consider my builds.

    The whole game is simply a series of challenges and puzzles. You can make a choice – either whine about it, or try to figure it out. I will always try to figure it out, and in 99% of cases there is a way to meet the challenge without spending a single coin.

    When something is newly released, my first thought is simply, it is what it is, and it is the same for everyone. So, how can I use it to get further ahead in my game? That being said, if it’s not going to get me further in game, then I’m still likely to get it, although not as a huge priority, just to ensure it doesn’t set me back on the FM at some stage, or alternately it becomes a useful item in future, or I’ve misjudged its value.

     

    I call BS. You start over and not coin and see how far you get. You are able use that approach because you started with much stronger ships, hulls and prizes that you got because you coined. I coined for a while and stopped, now my fleets are so far behind there is no way to ever catch up. You start from the beginning and record your progress then I will believe that a non-coiner can make it in this game now. Until then BS.
    i have started over multiple times, using no coins. all documented in the guide section. how i've done this account is also documented on and off in a number of different threads

    i have never coined.

    here you go, one example, going back to 2012 https://www.kixeye.com/forum/discussion/280508/p1 

    you can call BS all you like. but you'd be wrong.
    thats why in your vids you have the coin section covered so people cant see how many coin you have!  if you did not coin no reason to block it  !!!

    err. all the vids are fullscreen with nothing covered. i'm way too lazy to do that.

    you realise that you don't see coin totals when you're in battle right?

    i still even have xmas coins left over.
  • rob.swift.948494
    rob.swift.948494
    Potential Threat
    Joined May 2013 Posts: 76
    xmas coin what from 4 years ago! that  was the last time i got xmas coin  and  you must have no life other then bp to be able to do half of what you say you do   with no coin 
  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 7,490
    edited 13 Jan 2018, 9:04AM
    xmas coin what from 4 years ago! that  was the last time i got xmas coin  and  you must have no life other then bp to be able to do half of what you say you do   with no coin 
    yes it was from four years ago. i save them for when i need them. just like anything else like that (eg i have 150 unopened chests).

    and in fact the exact opposite. because i keep up, i can have much more of a life. its far less seat time to be hitting top tiers, or autoing.

    maybe you should read the whole guide. you'll learn quite a lot.
  • rob.swift.948494
    rob.swift.948494
    Potential Threat
    Joined May 2013 Posts: 76
    i have read your whole bs thread and i been playing long enough and have many of the same or close builds and i  know what you say is total bsto be able to do what you say you do is not possible  without coin you can say what you want we all know its bs


  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 7,490
    edited 13 Jan 2018, 10:34AM
    well you do need to have a little skill as well. and actually understand the game. but if you think 50+ vids on how to do the game coin free is bs, that's your decision to make. 

    Coming back to something actually useful now though  for Zoe's gamble -

    Tips for autoing/semi-autoing tier 7:

    85s: I can leave on full auto. fleet does not split up (although sometimes will take damage sitting in a fire field)
    81s: provided I enter straight away and start battle straight away it will then auto well
    83s: i can only auto after i force my entire fleet to head south, otherwise they split, with some going south, some going north, on a regular basis.

    Thinking about it though, that might be specific for my particular current fleet configuration.
  • Dazandren
    Dazandren
    Incursion Leader
    Joined Mar 2013 Posts: 1,172
    when you are doing the tier 7 and s sets, are you taking damage from anything other than the fire fields?  i've noticed in the 60s when i sit in front of a cluster of turrets with ironclads the only thing that damages me are the fire fields.

    i then got the notion of putting 2 sprints per bucc, no phalanx (as i don't see the missiles doing any damage to me; maybe they are stronger in the higher levels).  i thought if i can shoot the projectiles causing the fire fields out of the air before they land, then i wouldn't have to contend with the fire fields at all.

    this is just an idea, not been able to test it yet.  what are your thoughts?
    image
  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 7,490
    edited 14 Jan 2018, 8:22AM
    Dazandren said:
    when you are doing the tier 7 and s sets, are you taking damage from anything other than the fire fields?  i've noticed in the 60s when i sit in front of a cluster of turrets with ironclads the only thing that damages me are the fire fields.

    i then got the notion of putting 2 sprints per bucc, no phalanx (as i don't see the missiles doing any damage to me; maybe they are stronger in the higher levels).  i thought if i can shoot the projectiles causing the fire fields out of the air before they land, then i wouldn't have to contend with the fire fields at all.

    this is just an idea, not been able to test it yet.  what are your thoughts?
    i dont really hit the S sets. takes about as long as tier 7, and i have to actually drive more than a few seconds.

    the ballistic damage in tier 7 is pretty minimal yes.

    in tier 7 the single missiles create a firefield as well as those spread missiles. They hurt (particluarly in the 85), and always land on your ships if your phalanx doesnt shoot them down. Even with that many sprints, they don't shoot down all the little projectiles/big missiles (there was someone in my alliance with 4 sprint per ship and some still got through), so i'd stick with only a handful of sprints across the whole fleet.

    whether flcs shoots down more is another question though.
  • bort
    bort
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 7,490
    One quick tip for this week's vxp is to use your boon or blood to fix 75% of your fleet from each suicide. You should extremely easily skull the lot. (with the right CIC for the blood).
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