Upcoming Accuracy Bug Fix / Countermeasure Update

  • Cpt_Izno
    Cpt_Izno
    Potential Threat
    Joined Oct 2014 Posts: 28
    Ruube1 said:
    Cpt_Izno said:
    Countermeasures                                   Before Fix                                                           After Fix
    ...
    Elite Countermeasures                           Repeatedly targets all valid projectiles.               Targets missiles & rockets only once.
                                                                                                                                        Repeatedly targets mortars.
    ...

    This mean that you will fix the "bug" , when the MSC gets in range with the elite countermeasure it stop firing completely?
    Or this is another issue that we don't care?
    There is no bug on ECM. When MSC gets close enough its missiles will fly fast enough, 1.1seconds, into target and can not be countered. Or would like to make the MSC fleet totally useles by forcing ECM turret to shoot down all missiles no matter how close they are?

    When the MSC comes in range the tower stop fires everything, even the mortar shells, so this is a bug.
    If a second MSC fires from far, when the first MSC is in range, the tower doesn't shoot the second's ships missiles, because it has stopped working, so this is a bug.
    Sometimes it shoots the missile when the MSC is in range but not very close, so this is a bug.

    But this is really the point?
    Why would it be useless if the tower fire at them?
    Why the towers can stop the black rain and not the missiles? Doesn't that make the sloth useless? Do you stop using sloths?
    It is a strategy game, if the base can stop your missiles with a tower, get a ballistic ship with you, kill the tower and continue.
    When the base can stop your mortars what would you do?
    What do we want, make attack with one kind of ship and kill everything with no strategy?

    The fix is simple, make it hit everything and give it a minimum range. When the ship comes in that range it will stop fire at that ship. Simple and effective.


  • Pirate.Pete
    Pirate.Pete
    Potential Threat
    Joined Feb 2013 Posts: 74
    Hey!   If it's broken, just KIX it!   I really do believe in scary clowns now.
  • Wayward_son
    Wayward_son
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Apr 2016 Posts: 614
    edited 8 Jun 2018, 3:43AM
    On my main account, I was one of the first to see the potential of the vindicator, as a counter hull. So countermeasures were always part, of my game. I returned, after a year and a half off, to find i had an icebreaker fleet waiting. BTW thank you kixeye for kissing the 4$$es of deserters, and not your customers. Anyways it's a nice fleet, got a mill the first mission back, with 0 difficulty. I was so tempted to get the 5 ship w/flag Monolith fleet, $10.00 was very tempting, even though i knew it would not last too long. I had planned to get the fangtooth's offered today, but these proposed changes to counters, stopped that noise fast. Thank you for saying this early, so i would not waste money, love seeing you screw a sale that way.

    Anyways, was looking at a zelos refit for either blockade runner or a tank to the monoliths, i wanted to build. But 9 days for a full refit + a month to fully rank it. I now remember why i left, one decent fleet that will soon change, with the counter accuracy change, I am bored again and waiting. i guess it's time to stop playing again. After playing with my new fleet for 1 week, shortest comeback i ever had for any game

    Some bugs should stay in, like hiding under bases, this is a quality of life bug. I know, before you step in to correct, the targets will be adjusted, but how much? Double, triple, 4 fold the damage? Your adjustments have a habit of breaking the game, more than the bugs do

    Later, all i have to say
  • capt-ron
    capt-ron
    Potential Threat
    Joined Dec 2012 Posts: 33
    All I can add to this is "Liar liar, pants on fire."
  • Glitchomancy
    Glitchomancy
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Aug 2013 Posts: 325
    I get the feeling a some ppl don't understand the problems that these changes are going to fix.
    Firstly when they state countermeasures having a 100% accuracy increase bug this doesn't include anti pen and anti mortar just the ones categorised as countermeasures such as the sprint which on the blueprint has 70% accuracy yet will shoot down every rocket it targets no matter what hull it is on. 
    Secondly having all cm weapons and turrets following the same rules will prevent further conflicts and hopefully fix all previous ones such as anti mortars not firing because a cm that only fires once at mortars prevents them.

    The main concern is how they are going to adjust targets retroactively to compensate for the changes such as assault (raid and titanium) fm and the siege targets that are presently on hold, as these were all built assuming countermeasures were acting correctly such as increased damage, defences or flak evade.
  • kixeyeuser_1384609903109_100003522404108
    kixeyeuser_1384609903109_100003522404108
    Incursion Leader
    Joined Dec 2014 Posts: 1,482
    I get the feeling a some ppl don't understand the problems that these changes are going to fix.
    Firstly when they state countermeasures having a 100% accuracy increase bug this doesn't include anti pen and anti mortar just the ones categorised as countermeasures such as the sprint which on the blueprint has 70% accuracy yet will shoot down every rocket it targets no matter what hull it is on. 
    Secondly having all cm weapons and turrets following the same rules will prevent further conflicts and hopefully fix all previous ones such as anti mortars not firing because a cm that only fires once at mortars prevents them.

    The main concern is how they are going to adjust targets retroactively to compensate for the changes such as assault (raid and titanium) fm and the siege targets that are presently on hold, as these were all built assuming countermeasures were acting correctly such as increased damage, defences or flak evade.
    sry m8 but i disagree. using your sprint example if the sprint shots down every rocket then the player base would not have exploded a couple months ago when the fm change happened and all the sudden ibs were getting chewed and dragons for the last couple months players have been complaining and posting videos of counters not working in some cases not even firing so if their was a 100 percent bonus then everything would be shot down and those videos would not be. their is a bug in the game this we all know because of the incressed damage our fleets are taking in same targets with same counter fleets this fix will not fix this it will nerf us and require new refits plus the change to the zelos is a massive nerf that while it wont effect many of the top end players as we no longer need or use the zelo but a very large portion of the player base do and this is going to really hurt them another point to make that kix dose not know what is going on in the last raid their were players that had better out comes with different counters one player would have sprints and be getting ripped up but by changing to ph was fine and the next would have ph get destroyed but change to sprint and be fine i even know a couple that switched from sprint/ ph to switchblade to get best result so their is a bug but its not acc based because at different times it is effecting all counters(not just countermeasure) and it is always a negative effect a 100 acc bonus would be a positive effect
  • Alexa the BAE
    Alexa the BAE
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Aug 2014 Posts: 121

    In response to community feedback, we are making an effort to address long standing....

    Thank you for bringing this to light. Until now, I've been told by support that it was "visual" and clearing my cache and deleting cookies would help.
    "a computer once beat me at chess but it was no match for me at kick boxing"
  • zantil
    zantil
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Aug 2016 Posts: 354
    edited 8 Jun 2018, 2:31PM
    Kix, the problem is you are Micro Managing this game to death You make changes while not taking into account changes you made a week ago. Quick fix, get back to basics and stop the micro management I have said from the very beginning that you rely too much on programmers rather than players.
    Excatly.
  • tamdhu
    tamdhu
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Jun 2011 Posts: 321
    if you want us to be part of the journey how about communication and previews that if closed can at least be streamed atm all I hear are the same platitudes over and over again 
  • kixeyeuser_1375810824263_12234_28846940
    kixeyeuser_1375810824263_12234_28846940
    Unicorn Overlord
    Joined Feb 2016 Posts: 4,914

    @Dario Wilkowski said:
    So by what you just said you going to make the game even more imbalanced. Tell me who came up with idea of CM that shoot at any sort of projectile only once? Do you even play this game or ever played any game that used CM systems? Did you done any kind of research about CM systems we got in real life? CM shoot to projectile until its destroyed or hit target/s, doesnt matter whether its Rocket or Missile or Mortar it should repeatedly shot at em until its been countered. Only real solution for that problem is to get rid of multi CM Systems fitted on ships, so player would have to mix Anty Miss/Rocket/Mortar to get best performance. Only multi CM system should be on turrets with priority on closest projectile not just Tag Miss/Rocket once and then shoot at mortar. Closest projectile get Top Targeting priority and then move to next one, it get CM-ed or it hit it target simple.  
    Countermeasure

    Before Fix

    After Fix

    Deep Sea Countermeasure .      

    Repeatedly targets all valid projectiles.         

    Target only missiles or rockets or mortars.

    Repeatedly until destroyed 

    Nightwatch Mortars

    Targets each projectile only once.

    Target only missiles or rockets or mortars.

    Repeatedly until destroyed 

    Coxial Turret

    Targets each projectile only once.

    Targets closest missiles & rockets & mortars.

    Repeatedly until destroyed.

    Elite Countermeasures

    Repeatedly targets all valid projectiles.

    Targets closest missiles & rockets & mortars.

    Repeatedly until destroyed.

    Duality Countermeasure

    Repeatedly targets all valid projectiles.

    Target only missiles or rockets or mortars.

    Repeatedly until destroyed .

     

    I mean, I know of one other game that does this, but I mean, you can design and fine tune every component of your ships/tanks/aircraft, even the Hulls themselves you make personally.

    And you aren't limited to 1 shot per missile, I have 4 62mm CIWS that fire 7 Flak shells VERY RAPIDLY at missiles and even OTHER CANNON SHELLS.

    So I can see what they are doing here as TAME. But it doesn't help the players. But ey, it's better for balance! I guess.

  • paul.chen.524381
    paul.chen.524381
    Greenhorn
    Joined Jul 2013 Posts: 10
    So will this fix the raid for Manticore where Phalanx IV with Counter Measure Load IV, only shoot down some missiles??? :)
  • Captain Pants
    Captain Pants
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Aug 2014 Posts: 523
    You wankers don't have the greatest track record for fixing bugs in ways that don't actually make everything the players experience worse. 

    This is goona suck, isn't it?
  • TraderJack
    TraderJack
    Incursion Leader
    Joined May 2012 Posts: 1,082
    Well The day has come to finally quit playing this game.. It was fun but can't handle this new update.. So Good bye Kix and hope you keep your head above? water.. The game is sinking away to greed.
    But Didn't you hear ? They don't mind you build a tough base ; as long as their friends can flatten it.
  • TraderJack
    TraderJack
    Incursion Leader
    Joined May 2012 Posts: 1,082
    Ruube1 said:
    Cpt_Izno said:
    Countermeasures                                   Before Fix                                                           After Fix
    ...
    Elite Countermeasures                           Repeatedly targets all valid projectiles.               Targets missiles & rockets only once.
                                                                                                                                        Repeatedly targets mortars.
    ...

    This mean that you will fix the "bug" , when the MSC gets in range with the elite countermeasure it stop firing completely?
    Or this is another issue that we don't care?
    There is no bug on ECM. When MSC gets close enough its missiles will fly fast enough, 1.1seconds, into target and can not be countered. Or would like to make the MSC fleet totally useles by forcing ECM turret to shoot down all missiles no matter how close they are?
    Ruube1 said:
    Cpt_Izno said:
    Countermeasures                                   Before Fix                                                           After Fix
    ...
    Elite Countermeasures                           Repeatedly targets all valid projectiles.               Targets missiles & rockets only once.
                                                                                                                                        Repeatedly targets mortars.
    ...

    This mean that you will fix the "bug" , when the MSC gets in range with the elite countermeasure it stop firing completely?
    Or this is another issue that we don't care?
    There is no bug on ECM. When MSC gets close enough its missiles will fly fast enough, 1.1seconds, into target and can not be countered. Or would like to make the MSC fleet totally useles by forcing ECM turret to shoot down all missiles no matter how close they are?
    Sounds like that needs to be fixed ! Lets just make the reload time on the ECm.
  • iceice69
    iceice69
    Potential Threat
    Joined Apr 2017 Posts: 66
    Really doesn't matter.  you allow 129 levels with t7 hulls to hit level 50 bases.  fix that unbalance then we will be interested.
  • Mark Lenard
    Mark Lenard
    Minor Nuisance
    Joined Oct 2012 Posts: 252
    Ryan Baum said:
    Do You realize with every UPDATE you say your gonna do your hurting the player base and killing the game............. To me and most that read these update notices we see it as Kixeye is trying to kill the game off. Was moving Battle Pirates over to HTML that hard you just said lets kill Battle Pirates and then we will start a new game in HTML. Its not going to work. Most of Kixeye will be hunting for a new job if this continues. This is not a successful business model. No person in there right mind is ever gonna start playing another kixeye game after the way you showed your incompetence to get anything right
     
    i for one if a company runs a game this badly any game they start i stay away from since they already killed a game

  • kixeyeuser_1423071321100_100005569801757
    kixeyeuser_1423071321100_100005569801757
    Potential Threat
    Joined Mar 2015 Posts: 55
    Add me to the abandoned bases.   Tired of the constant changes to make the game more expensive.  My flt was glowing like a Christmas tree from the 1st set of turrets in a 111.  Used to get zero damage from them.  Could understand 10 to 15 secs of increased damage per turret, but not 10 mins.   Now I can keep my money.  
  • Drinks
    Drinks
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Sep 2012 Posts: 427

    Countermeasure Update

    The team is updating the way that countermeasures work, to bring them in line with the expectations of how they should behave.

    Currently, most countermeasures that target rockets or missiles get a single shot at countering that projectile, while countermeasures that target mortars get multiple shots at countering that projectile.  UAVs act differently, in that they can get targeted by countermeasures until they reach their first target, at which point the UAVs become immune and will move from target to target .

    When introducing countermeasures that were able to target both mortars and missiles, such as Zelo’s built in Duality Countermeasure and the Nightwatch Countermeasure, this introduced problems with how they interacted with projectiles.  A dual countermeasure treated both missiles and mortars the same, which means it either repeatedly targeted both missiles and mortars, or it only took one shot at either missiles or mortars. As such, combining these countermeasures with other countermeasures could cause poor performance (see Example #1 below).

    When a missile is fired at by a countermeasure, it is “tagged” so that it will not be targeted again.  When a mortar is fired at by a countermeasure, it is not tagged and can continued to be targeted by counter measures.  Currently, this tag is defined by the countermeasure. Moving forward, we are changing this to tag a projectile, or not, based on the specific projectile that it is firing at. Let’s look at some examples:

    Example #1:

    Currently: The Nightwatch Countermeasure is “tagging” all projectiles it shoots at.  So, if you have equipped a Nightwatch Countermeasure and Gale Defense System III and the Nightwatch shoots a mortar, it becomes “tagged” and the Gale Defense System III will no longer target it.  
    After the Update: Nightwatch Countermeasure no longer “tags” mortars and Gales Defense System III continues to fire at that mortar (as will the Nightwatch).

    Example #2

    Currently: The Zelo’s built-in Duality Countermeasure does not “tag” any of the projectiles it shoots at, which means that it can repeatedly target any missiles or rockets that it fires at. However,if you had a Phalanx Anti-Missile System IV equipped on your Zelos, once it targeted a missile it would be “tagged” and no additional countermeasures (including Duality Countermeasures) would target it.

    After the Update: Zelo’s Duality Countermeasure “tags” missiles or rockets that it fires at, and no other countermeasures fire at them.

    Conclusion

    With both of these changes, your experience in Battle Pirates is being brought much closer to what is expected based on listed stats.  We are striving to improve the experience of Battle Pirate every day, and we appreciate your being a part of this journey.

    I am a bit confused by two of the statements above. If someone could explain:
    • Currently, this tag is defined by the countermeasure. Moving forward, we are changing this to tag a projectile, or not, based on the specific projectile that it is firing at
    and
    • After the Update: Zelo’s Duality Countermeasure “tags” missiles or rockets that it fires at, and no other countermeasures fire at them.
    To me this sounds like you have two different systems that will be in place and it is up to the countermeasure to tag the projectile. If this is the case, then the "bug" will not be fixed and you will have a bigger issue.

    I say this at work, and I hope you take this to heart, since most other things you do you don't.

    "There are a thousand ways to do the same thing, pick one."

    This solution is is not picking one, you are picking 2 solutions and combining them into a solution. This has often caused more issues than solved.
    image
  • Wayward_son
    Wayward_son
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Apr 2016 Posts: 614
    edited 9 Jun 2018, 7:23PM
    Ryan Baum said:
    Do You realize with every UPDATE you say your gonna do your hurting the player base and killing the game............. To me and most that read these update notices we see it as Kixeye is trying to kill the game off. Was moving Battle Pirates over to HTML that hard you just said lets kill Battle Pirates and then we will start a new game in HTML. Its not going to work. Most of Kixeye will be hunting for a new job if this continues. This is not a successful business model. No person in there right mind is ever gonna start playing another kixeye game after the way you showed your incompetence to get anything right
     
    i for one if a company runs a game this badly any game they start i stay away from since they already killed a game

    I have said many times, if i hear of Will Harbin moving to a game company, of a game i currently play, other than BP. I will immediately uninstall and tell them the exact, reasons for the uninstall. Along with a good luck and Via Con dios (Go with God), because they will need all the help they can get, when he F's up that game.
  • Glitchomancy
    Glitchomancy
    Skilled Warrior
    Joined Aug 2013 Posts: 325
    Drinks said:

    Countermeasure Update

    The team is updating the way that countermeasures work, to bring them in line with the expectations of how they should behave.

    Currently, most countermeasures that target rockets or missiles get a single shot at countering that projectile, while countermeasures that target mortars get multiple shots at countering that projectile.  UAVs act differently, in that they can get targeted by countermeasures until they reach their first target, at which point the UAVs become immune and will move from target to target .

    When introducing countermeasures that were able to target both mortars and missiles, such as Zelo’s built in Duality Countermeasure and the Nightwatch Countermeasure, this introduced problems with how they interacted with projectiles.  A dual countermeasure treated both missiles and mortars the same, which means it either repeatedly targeted both missiles and mortars, or it only took one shot at either missiles or mortars. As such, combining these countermeasures with other countermeasures could cause poor performance (see Example #1 below).

    When a missile is fired at by a countermeasure, it is “tagged” so that it will not be targeted again.  When a mortar is fired at by a countermeasure, it is not tagged and can continued to be targeted by counter measures.  Currently, this tag is defined by the countermeasure. Moving forward, we are changing this to tag a projectile, or not, based on the specific projectile that it is firing at. Let’s look at some examples:

    Example #1:

    Currently: The Nightwatch Countermeasure is “tagging” all projectiles it shoots at.  So, if you have equipped a Nightwatch Countermeasure and Gale Defense System III and the Nightwatch shoots a mortar, it becomes “tagged” and the Gale Defense System III will no longer target it.  
    After the Update: Nightwatch Countermeasure no longer “tags” mortars and Gales Defense System III continues to fire at that mortar (as will the Nightwatch).

    Example #2

    Currently: The Zelo’s built-in Duality Countermeasure does not “tag” any of the projectiles it shoots at, which means that it can repeatedly target any missiles or rockets that it fires at. However,if you had a Phalanx Anti-Missile System IV equipped on your Zelos, once it targeted a missile it would be “tagged” and no additional countermeasures (including Duality Countermeasures) would target it.

    After the Update: Zelo’s Duality Countermeasure “tags” missiles or rockets that it fires at, and no other countermeasures fire at them.

    Conclusion

    With both of these changes, your experience in Battle Pirates is being brought much closer to what is expected based on listed stats.  We are striving to improve the experience of Battle Pirate every day, and we appreciate your being a part of this journey.

    I am a bit confused by two of the statements above. If someone could explain:
    • Currently, this tag is defined by the countermeasure. Moving forward, we are changing this to tag a projectile, or not, based on the specific projectile that it is firing at
    and
    • After the Update: Zelo’s Duality Countermeasure “tags” missiles or rockets that it fires at, and no other countermeasures fire at them.
    To me this sounds like you have two different systems that will be in place and it is up to the countermeasure to tag the projectile. If this is the case, then the "bug" will not be fixed and you will have a bigger issue.

    I say this at work, and I hope you take this to heart, since most other things you do you don't.

    "There are a thousand ways to do the same thing, pick one."

    This solution is is not picking one, you are picking 2 solutions and combining them into a solution. This has often caused more issues than solved.
    going forward all cm will go by the same rule missiles and rockets can only be fired at once, mortars until they are destroyed or land, before the duality ignored the rules while night watch imposed additional rules
  • dragoon25
    dragoon25
    Potential Threat
    Joined Jun 2013 Posts: 51

    Changes to Specific Items

    Countermeasure

    Before Fix

    After Fix

    Deep Sea Countermeasure .      

    Repeatedly targets all valid projectiles.         

    Targets missiles & rockets only once.

    Repeatedly targets mortars.


    Nightwatch Mortars

    Targets each projectile only once.

    Targets missiles & rockets only once.

    Repeatedly targets mortars.

    Coxial Turret

    Targets each projectile only once.

    Targets missiles & rockets only once.

    Repeatedly targets mortars.

    Elite Countermeasures

    Repeatedly targets all valid projectiles.

    Targets missiles & rockets only once.

    Repeatedly targets mortars.

    Duality Countermeasure

    Repeatedly targets all valid projectiles.

    Target missiles & rockets only once.

    Repeatedly targets mortars.

    TL;DR

    • We are updating counter measures to act as expected, and maintain consistency across the game

    • Mortars and UAVs will be targeted by countermeasures repeatedly

    • Missiles and Rockets will be targeted by countermeasures once

    Conclusion

    With both of these changes, your experience in Battle Pirates is being brought much closer to what is expected based on listed stats.  We are striving to improve the experience of Battle Pirate every day, and we appreciate your being a part of this journey.

    why not just allow all cms to attack everything repeatedly and add some evasion to enemy weapons?
  • Wayward_son
    Wayward_son
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Apr 2016 Posts: 614
    dragoon25 said:

    Changes to Specific Items

    Countermeasure

    Before Fix

    After Fix

    Deep Sea Countermeasure .      

    Repeatedly targets all valid projectiles.         

    Targets missiles & rockets only once.

    Repeatedly targets mortars.


    Nightwatch Mortars

    Targets each projectile only once.

    Targets missiles & rockets only once.

    Repeatedly targets mortars.

    Coxial Turret

    Targets each projectile only once.

    Targets missiles & rockets only once.

    Repeatedly targets mortars.

    Elite Countermeasures

    Repeatedly targets all valid projectiles.

    Targets missiles & rockets only once.

    Repeatedly targets mortars.

    Duality Countermeasure

    Repeatedly targets all valid projectiles.

    Target missiles & rockets only once.

    Repeatedly targets mortars.

    TL;DR

    • We are updating counter measures to act as expected, and maintain consistency across the game

    • Mortars and UAVs will be targeted by countermeasures repeatedly

    • Missiles and Rockets will be targeted by countermeasures once

    Conclusion

    With both of these changes, your experience in Battle Pirates is being brought much closer to what is expected based on listed stats.  We are striving to improve the experience of Battle Pirate every day, and we appreciate your being a part of this journey.

    why not just allow all cms to attack everything repeatedly and add some evasion to enemy weapons?
    It would be much easier to code and more reliant on their favorite troll gimmick, the RNG
  • LSD68
    LSD68
    Potential Threat
    Joined Oct 2011 Posts: 94
    Basically what it means is that when everything is working as expected that you will get a lot more damage even in FM targets. My guess is we will go under 25k players soon.
  • Wayward_son
    Wayward_son
    Strike-force Captain
    Joined Apr 2016 Posts: 614
    LSD68 said:
    Basically what it means is that when everything is working as expected that you will get a lot more damage even in FM targets. My guess is we will go under 25k players soon.
    I took a year and a half off, got a free icebreaker fleet, so started playing some. I was honestly tempted, to buy a Monolith fleet for $10.00, even though it's already had it's day in the sun, it'a still better than anything i got short of said Icebreakers. I saw this thread, before i pulled the trigger. And kixeye just lost a sale. They now have 4 fleets, for sale at $8.00 and they won't be bought by me, because of this Now "bug". When before this it was a visual error or "working as intended", At least it was posted, before i actually bought something, only to regret it later.

    With the coming changes, the monolith will be further nerfed, meaning it will be completely useless. And that $10.00 i would have spent, would be a waste. So thank you Kixeye, for showing me why i stopped buying gold, for this game
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